Do we really need Europa League or is it a neccessay Evil?

[Glenn R]

  Voice,
               The reason Chelsea/Man City/Man U and to a degree Arse--- have succeeded is largely due to the fact that they have spent enormous amounts of money in transfer fees and pay ridiculous wages to build squads that will be competitive in the CL. Levy absolutely refuses to pay ridiculous wages and you cannot blame him, although it does affect the quality of players that we can attract, and there-in lies the problem! 

And one of the ways they got that money was having  bigger grounds than we have.
1.   Chelsea won the league with a capacity of 41,837
2.   City’s capacity is 48,000
3.   Ars*nal’s capacity is 60,272
4.   United’s 76,962
5.   Liverpool’s 45,276
6.   Spurs 36,000 plus
On top of that their extra revenue is better than ours. We finished where we should have. Granted those top clubs had millionaires throwing money at their clubs, but now the fair play rules have come in they can only spend what they take in. We finished we were deserved to be finished.

   

I have to disagree with you that we were punching above our weight when we qualified for the CL as was shown in our performances in the CL the following season, you do not beat the quality of opposition that we beat if you don't have a quality side or squad plus the style of football that we were playing under Harry Redknapp was fantastic(I am not re-opening the "Arry debate) and I must admit that at times this season under Poch we are starting to play in a style that does get the adrenalin flowing so hopefully he is allowed to continue the good work that he has started.   

When we finished 4th in 2009/10 City were having managerial problems so we replaced them.
When we finished 4th in 2011/12 Chelsea were also having problems and we replaced them.
We finished 4th in the history of the Premier league only twice.
Daniel Level in his article to the Spurs fans this month says “I know you would like somebody to throw money at the club, but that isn’t going to happen under the fair play rules.” Clubs have to live within their means. We are where we should be and only finished 4th because of the misfortunes of those that are regularly there misperforming.
Harry was lucky, but if I accepted he was brilliant he was so brilliant that when he left nobody was queuing up to take him on. Finally he got QPR. England didn’t want him, United didn’t want him and most of the other clubs didn’t want him. That should tell you something, on top of that he was fired from Spurs.
If we finish above 5th then it will be because of the misfortunes of others, or I should say those that are regularly in the top 4.

I liked Harry and I thought he did a good job at Spurs while he was there, but I have to agree with you here. He did what he was asked to do, but Levy and most of the fans knew his limitations. That is why he was only a stop gap for Spurs.

As for punching above our weight, I agree. I am a season ticket holder and if we compete with the top four on an even level then we need the same financial incentives as the other clubs have. And that includes a better stadium.

When I watched Spurs fight for 4th spot I knew, and most of the Spurs supporters I was in contact with knew, that if we were going to replace one of the golden boys then it would have been because one of them had slipped below par, and in the two cases that voice highlighted they did.

A 56,000 seater stadium will give us better revenue and a stronger position.

Jane x

    Voice,
            When City qualified to play CL in season 2011-2012 it was the first time since 1968-69,(hardly a Champions League regular) and they did so simply because they Paid over the top transfer fees and wages in order to finish 3rd in PL, whether they were having Managerial problems or not is of little consequence, the same applies to Chelsea, we finished in 4th position because WE WERE BETTER than them, who gives a monkeys that they were having problems, you obviously believe that we didn't deserve to finish in 4th position and gain CL football, and if I remember correctly, the only reason that we missed out in 2013-2014 was because Chelsea won CL in 2012-2013 which gave them automatic qualification over us. 

Yes, you may read it that way and of course we were 4th because we were better. But not by much; The first time around we were 3pts ahead of City. That is just a coin tossing piece of luck. Granted I am not knocking it, but I do accept it had a lot to do with luck. The second time we were 4th by 4 pts. Both were not an overwhelming endorsement.  But again we won, and the same time we lost because Chelsea won the European Trophy that year. So not so lucky as before. Whatever way we read it Harry eventually took his eye of the ball and thought he had bigger fish to fry and ended up with nothing; other than the booby prize, QPR.

[Glenn R]

Yes, Jane, this forum is about Spurs. You haven't been a member for long, but you should definitely browse through old threads and see how every single one of them ended up with a Harry Redknapp debate. Most of us are simply sick and tired of it.

I would still say that it's anyone's right to bring up anything connected to Spurs. I do it quite often, whether anyone responds to it is up to them. When nobody does, I generally drop the particular subject.
Personally I would like to bang on about Jimmy Greaves and Alan Gilzean all day, and no doubt somewhere somebody would be interested. Same applies to Harry no doubt.
Lastly Harry was at my golf club, Upminster, 2 weeks ago for lunch. Unfortunately I was in Spain at the time, as apparently he had quite a few chats with some of the members of whom quite a few are Spurs fans.

I agree. I also agree with Riffhard that some people are sick of it. Simples! Those that don't want to talk about him, don't. And those that do, do. If nobody wants to engage with that person then it will die quietly.

It is interesting to observe that it was Mr Finch that brought it up, but has criticised in the past for it being brought up. And Riffhard was sick of it, but brought it up so that others could debate the values of debating something that certain people were sick off. I hope members can see the irony of this?
           
           Whether people like it or not Harry Redknapp is part of our history; for good or for bad. And this forum is about Spurs; past, present and future.

           Voice and Riff,
                             Give me a break, I was responding to Voice's comment regarding us punching above our weight when we qualified for the CL, and I was very quick to add that I WAS NOT   re-opening the 'Arry debate again, so please give me the courtesy of READING ALL of my post before you start criticising and casting aspersions.

Whether that was your intention or not your comments contributed to adding to the Harry debate. Besides; what is wrong with it? Harry is part of our history and should be mentioned where and when necessary. This forum is about Spurs, not Spurs, but Harry has been scrubbed from our history. I acknowledge his contributions; he rescued us from the bottom of the premier league. Whatever the reasons we got to 4th spot it was done under Harry's watch and that should be acknowledged, however it is wished to be acknowledged.

[Paul Finch]

Yes, Jane, this forum is about Spurs. You haven't been a member for long, but you should definitely browse through old threads and see how every single one of them ended up with a Harry Redknapp debate. Most of us are simply sick and tired of it.

I would still say that it's anyone's right to bring up anything connected to Spurs. I do it quite often, whether anyone responds to it is up to them. When nobody does, I generally drop the particular subject.
Personally I would like to bang on about Jimmy Greaves and Alan Gilzean all day, and no doubt somewhere somebody would be interested. Same applies to Harry no doubt.
Lastly Harry was at my golf club, Upminster, 2 weeks ago for lunch. Unfortunately I was in Spain at the time, as apparently he had quite a few chats with some of the members of whom quite a few are Spurs fans.

I agree. I also agree with Riffhard that some people are sick of it. Simples! Those that don't want to talk about him, don't. And those that do, do. If nobody wants to engage with that person then it will die quietly.

It is interesting to observe that it was Mr Finch that brought it up, but has criticised in the past for it being brought up. And Riffhard was sick of it, but brought it up so that others could debate the values of debating something that certain people were sick off. I hope members can see the irony of this?
           
           Whether people like it or not Harry Redknapp is part of our history; for good or for bad. And this forum is about Spurs; past, present and future.

           Voice and Riff,
                             Give me a break, I was responding to Voice's comment regarding us punching above our weight when we qualified for the CL, and I was very quick to add that I WAS NOT   re-opening the 'Arry debate again, so please give me the courtesy of READING ALL of my post before you start criticising and casting aspersions.

Whether that was your intention or not your comments contributed to adding to the Harry debate. Besides; what is wrong with it? Harry is part of our history and should be mentioned where and when necessary. This forum is about Spurs, not Spurs, but Harry has been scrubbed from our history. I acknowledge his contributions; he rescued us from the bottom of the premier league. Whatever the reasons we got to 4th spot it was done under Harry's watch and that should be acknowledged, however it is wished to be acknowledged.

          Voice,
             Yet again you have turned this into the Harry Redknapp debate not me, but of course YOU are never wrong are you, once more you make a personal attack on me, another reason for me to discontinue contributing to this forum, I have had a gutful. Goodbye!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Spursx]

Whether we punched above our weight or not there is an element of luck as well. Maybe the examples of Harry was part of that luck, but we should always go into a seasons expecting to win the title and some trophies. Without hope we just become a West Ham or QPR or Southampton or one of the other midtable teams. I don't believe it is impossible for an outside (outside the top 4) to come in and get a good run going and actually threaten to win the title. Blackburn was one of the few to win the Premiership and look where they are now.

[RSS61]

Whether we punched above our weight or not there is an element of luck as well. Maybe the examples of Harry was part of that luck, but we should always go into a seasons expecting to win the title and some trophies. Without hope we just become a West Ham or QPR or Southampton or one of the other midtable teams. I don't believe it is impossible for an outside (outside the top 4) to come in and get a good run going and actually threaten to win the title. Blackburn was one of the few to win the Premiership and look where they are now.

The thing that I find rather alarming is that Ars*nal seem to have re-discovered their form, their better players are all doing well. Considering that Chelsea, Man City & Man U don't look like falling out of the top 4 anytime soon, that leaves no room for us in the foreseeable future, UNLESS we can up our game significantly.
To go back to the subject of this thread, then I would say YES it is a necessary evil. Surely, any European football is better than none, and there is always that extra CL place on offer if somehow we can win the Europa. In my opinion that is going to be easier than getting into the top 4 PL. For a start the level of opposition must be lower than PL and there are half the number of games to play.

[Glenn R]

Whether we punched above our weight or not there is an element of luck as well. Maybe the examples of Harry was part of that luck, but we should always go into a seasons expecting to win the title and some trophies. Without hope we just become a West Ham or QPR or Southampton or one of the other midtable teams. I don't believe it is impossible for an outside (outside the top 4) to come in and get a good run going and actually threaten to win the title. Blackburn was one of the few to win the Premiership and look where they are now.

The thing that I find rather alarming is that Ars*nal seem to have re-discovered their form, their better players are all doing well. Considering that Chelsea, Man City & Man U don't look like falling out of the top 4 anytime soon, that leaves no room for us in the foreseeable future, UNLESS we can up our game significantly.
To go back to the subject of this thread, then I would say YES it is a necessary evil. Surely, any European football is better than none, and there is always that extra CL place on offer if somehow we can win the Europa. In my opinion that is going to be easier than getting into the top 4 PL. For a start the level of opposition must be lower than PL and there are half the number of games to play.

To challenge for a top four spot Spurs need consistency and the same manager. We also need to buy big and I can't see that happening until sometime after the new stadium is built. Pochettino is ambitious and if Levy can't give him what he wants - success - then he will leave and we will start the process all over again.

[Don]

Whether we punched above our weight or not there is an element of luck as well. Maybe the examples of Harry was part of that luck, but we should always go into a seasons expecting to win the title and some trophies. Without hope we just become a West Ham or QPR or Southampton or one of the other midtable teams. I don't believe it is impossible for an outside (outside the top 4) to come in and get a good run going and actually threaten to win the title. Blackburn was one of the few to win the Premiership and look where they are now.

The thing that I find rather alarming is that Ars*nal seem to have re-discovered their form, their better players are all doing well. Considering that Chelsea, Man City & Man U don't look like falling out of the top 4 anytime soon, that leaves no room for us in the foreseeable future, UNLESS we can up our game significantly.
To go back to the subject of this thread, then I would say YES it is a necessary evil. Surely, any European football is better than none, and there is always that extra CL place on offer if somehow we can win the Europa. In my opinion that is going to be easier than getting into the top 4 PL. For a start the level of opposition must be lower than PL and there are half the number of games to play.

To challenge for a top four spot Spurs need consistency and the same manager. We also need to buy big and I can't see that happening until sometime after the new stadium is built. Pochettino is ambitious and if Levy can't give him what he wants - success - then he will leave and we will start the process all over again.

Howdy voice,

I'll go along with what you say here. Tottenham is a club that has always challenged the best, but over the years they've fallen down the pecking list and they now need to reclaim those glory days and bring them back to the present day. A new stadium will play an important part in that quest. But we also must compete over what the players are paid, that is comparing them to the top four teams. Tottenham are certainly a top sixth club, but we need to set our sights higher and that won’t be an easy achievement. Whether it be Europa League or Champions league we are certainly a European team. Be that pedigree or history.
Don

[a12 warrior]

I have read this thread and really can't believe that most think there is a good reason to be in the Europa Cup.
A long drawn out competition that really only benefits the club through TV money and gate money.
Champions leg is where Spurs need to be but with the squad we have at the moment it's a million miles away and before someone quotes that we finished 5th true we did but some of the football we served up last season was down right boring!! And we still threw away points to teams we should have beaten.
Harry Kane and Loris are quality so is Erikson but the rest are pretty average
As ever I am looking forward to the new season with the belief that all Spurs supporters have, that this will be our season it would be great if the team delivers for the supporters as we need to break into that top 4 elite group.

[RSS61]

I have read this thread and really can't believe that most think there is a good reason to be in the Europa Cup.
A long drawn out competition that really only benefits the club through TV money and gate money.
Champions leg is where Spurs need to be but with the squad we have at the moment it's a million miles away and before someone quotes that we finished 5th true we did but some of the football we served up last season was down right boring!! And we still threw away points to teams we should have beaten.
Harry Kane and Loris are quality so is Erikson but the rest are pretty average
As ever I am looking forward to the new season with the belief that all Spurs supporters have, that this will be our season it would be great if the team delivers for the supporters as we need to break into that top 4 elite group.

The point is that teams who finish 5th - 6th are obliged to play in the Europa League, it is not an option. Therefore until we are good enough to get in the top 4, which lets face it is now a very tall order, looking at how Man Utd have strengthened, then EL it is for us, unless we are deliberately going to lose games and finish 8th, which would be ridiculous.

[Glenn R]

I have read this thread and really can't believe that most think there is a good reason to be in the Europa Cup.
A long drawn out competition that really only benefits the club through TV money and gate money.
Champions leg is where Spurs need to be but with the squad we have at the moment it's a million miles away and before someone quotes that we finished 5th true we did but some of the football we served up last season was down right boring!! And we still threw away points to teams we should have beaten.
Harry Kane and Loris are quality so is Erikson but the rest are pretty average
As ever I am looking forward to the new season with the belief that all Spurs supporters have, that this will be our season it would be great if the team delivers for the supporters as we need to break into that top 4 elite group.

The point is that teams who finish 5th - 6th are obliged to play in the Europa League, it is not an option. Therefore until we are good enough to get in the top 4, which lets face it is now a very tall order, looking at how Man Utd have strengthened, then EL it is for us, unless we are deliberately going to lose games and finish 8th, which would be ridiculous.

I agree. Spurs are a top six club and until they reach the top 4 they will be - or should be - in the Europa league. We also must not forget that winning this competition will get us into the Champions Cup.

[a12 warrior]

I agree with you guys Europa Cup is not an option if you finish 5th.
For me as I write this can't see anyway will break into the top 4 they are all getting better we continue to be content with average players and mediocre performances oh for a Modric Bale Keane Berbatov Van de Vart but I am afraid those days are long gone!

[RSS61]

I agree with you guys Europa Cup is not an option if you finish 5th.
For me as I write this can't see anyway will break into the top 4 they are all getting better we continue to be content with average players and mediocre performances oh for a Modric Bale Keane Berbatov Van de Vart but I am afraid those days are long gone!

Yes so long as clubs like Man City etc are able to pay players 150 k a week to sit on the bench then that is most definitely the case.

[Spursx]

We must remember that we finished 5th, four points behind United. So it is not outside our reach.