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Are we beaten before we start!!!

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Offline Glenn R

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Re: Are we beaten before we start!!!
« Reply #45 on: July 22, 2014, 07:08:34 PM »
Things are looking up a bit in the transfer gossip, but nothing of great importance yet. So I will wait until something concrete happens before I get that positive feeling!

I agree, however, if you believe in everything they say or who we are going to buy then we also must sell. Some of the names they mention seem mouth watering. I do think we should sell Ade and diffidently get another striker. However I think Soldado should stay. Probably another defender as well.

Ade, Soldado and Kane to stay with another value addition or bring through another from the youth team.  I think given a run in the team and growing confidence Kane could be a gem, if we dont try we will never know.  Selling Ade is not an option unless we have an experienced proven EPL striker, Hernandez anyone!

The trouble with Ade is that he fades. He did that under AVB and Sherwood. Of course I am not talking about selling him without a replacement, that would be stupid. He might be better if he had strong competition.
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Regrets, I’ve had a few;
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Offline RSS61

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Re: Are we beaten before we start!!!
« Reply #46 on: July 23, 2014, 08:58:41 AM »
Things are looking up a bit in the transfer gossip, but nothing of great importance yet. So I will wait until something concrete happens before I get that positive feeling!

I agree, however, if you believe in everything they say or who we are going to buy then we also must sell. Some of the names they mention seem mouth watering. I do think we should sell Ade and diffidently get another striker. However I think Soldado should stay. Probably another defender as well.
Selling Ade is not an option unless we have an experienced proven EPL striker, Hernandez anyone!
I'm not sure Hernandez is suited to play as the lone striker (if Pochettino decides to go down that path), but he would be a great addition nevertheless.

I think that Pochettino is definitely going down that route. He plays 1 up front with 3 behind, so where does that leave Soldado ? This has been his problem all along I think. Kane and Abel (sorry Ade !) can play that role, but I don't see Soldado fitting in.

Offline Glenn R

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Re: Are we beaten before we start!!!
« Reply #47 on: July 23, 2014, 10:50:23 AM »
Things are looking up a bit in the transfer gossip, but nothing of great importance yet. So I will wait until something concrete happens before I get that positive feeling!

I agree, however, if you believe in everything they say or who we are going to buy then we also must sell. Some of the names they mention seem mouth watering. I do think we should sell Ade and diffidently get another striker. However I think Soldado should stay. Probably another defender as well.
Selling Ade is not an option unless we have an experienced proven EPL striker, Hernandez anyone!
I'm not sure Hernandez is suited to play as the lone striker (if Pochettino decides to go down that path), but he would be a great addition nevertheless.

I think that Pochettino is definitely going down that route. He plays 1 up front with 3 behind, so where does that leave Soldado ? This has been his problem all along I think. Kane and Abel (sorry Ade !) can play that role, but I don't see Soldado fitting in.

He can fit in providing he stays within the box. The problem with last season was that he was all over the place.
I’ve lived a life that’s full. I’ve travelled each and every highway;
And more, much more than this,
I did it my way.

Regrets, I’ve had a few;
But then again, too few to mention.
I did what I had to do
And saw it through without exemption.

Offline RiffHard

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Re: Are we beaten before we start!!!
« Reply #48 on: July 23, 2014, 11:00:38 AM »
Things are looking up a bit in the transfer gossip, but nothing of great importance yet. So I will wait until something concrete happens before I get that positive feeling!

I agree, however, if you believe in everything they say or who we are going to buy then we also must sell. Some of the names they mention seem mouth watering. I do think we should sell Ade and diffidently get another striker. However I think Soldado should stay. Probably another defender as well.
Selling Ade is not an option unless we have an experienced proven EPL striker, Hernandez anyone!
I'm not sure Hernandez is suited to play as the lone striker (if Pochettino decides to go down that path), but he would be a great addition nevertheless.

I think that Pochettino is definitely going down that route. He plays 1 up front with 3 behind, so where does that leave Soldado ? This has been his problem all along I think. Kane and Abel (sorry Ade !) can play that role, but I don't see Soldado fitting in.

He can fit in providing he stays within the box. The problem with last season was that he was all over the place.
And this proves his tactical weakness - as he's playing alone up front he tends to get isolated. Then he'll try to make himself more useful by drifting into the wing and not being where he needs to be. But, who knows - maybe Pochettino can turn Soldado into a lone striker. Villas-Boas couldn't, but to be fair, Soldado had just joined back then.

Offline Glenn R

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Re: Are we beaten before we start!!!
« Reply #49 on: July 23, 2014, 04:09:57 PM »
Things are looking up a bit in the transfer gossip, but nothing of great importance yet. So I will wait until something concrete happens before I get that positive feeling!

I agree, however, if you believe in everything they say or who we are going to buy then we also must sell. Some of the names they mention seem mouth watering. I do think we should sell Ade and diffidently get another striker. However I think Soldado should stay. Probably another defender as well.
Selling Ade is not an option unless we have an experienced proven EPL striker, Hernandez anyone!
I'm not sure Hernandez is suited to play as the lone striker (if Pochettino decides to go down that path), but he would be a great addition nevertheless.

I think that Pochettino is definitely going down that route. He plays 1 up front with 3 behind, so where does that leave Soldado ? This has been his problem all along I think. Kane and Abel (sorry Ade !) can play that role, but I don't see Soldado fitting in.

He can fit in providing he stays within the box. The problem with last season was that he was all over the place.
And this proves his tactical weakness - as he's playing alone up front he tends to get isolated. Then he'll try to make himself more useful by drifting into the wing and not being where he needs to be. But, who knows - maybe Pochettino can turn Soldado into a lone striker. Villas-Boas couldn't, but to be fair, Soldado had just joined back then.

You say that AVB couldn't and I would agree that you are partly right. As I have said previous you can't buy 7 players and then expect to embed them all in within a season. I thought his play under Sherwood was worse than under AVB. However, I do agree that hopefully Pochettino can turn Soldado into a very good striker. He has publicly said that he is happy with the squad he inherited.   
I’ve lived a life that’s full. I’ve travelled each and every highway;
And more, much more than this,
I did it my way.

Regrets, I’ve had a few;
But then again, too few to mention.
I did what I had to do
And saw it through without exemption.

Offline taimedowne

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Re: Are we beaten before we start!!!
« Reply #50 on: July 23, 2014, 06:22:12 PM »
The sad fact is we are a 2nd tier club. Players want to play in the Champions League so they hold out to see if they can get a move to a CL club. Only once they accept that's not going to happen do they look at the likes of us. That's why we do the majority of our deals late in the window. We are 2nd or 3rd choice to these guys. We will pick up a few young ones who are not yet ready for the CL before hand but the bulk of the business will be done only when the CL clubs have filled their squads. 

Offline Glenn R

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Re: Are we beaten before we start!!!
« Reply #51 on: July 23, 2014, 07:04:07 PM »
The sad fact is we are a 2nd tier club. Players want to play in the Champions League so they hold out to see if they can get a move to a CL club. Only once they accept that's not going to happen do they look at the likes of us. That's why we do the majority of our deals late in the window. We are 2nd or 3rd choice to these guys. We will pick up a few young ones who are not yet ready for the CL before hand but the bulk of the business will be done only when the CL clubs have filled their squads.

If we were a second rate club we wouldn't get players like Lloris to join us. We have the potential to be a top 4 club; what we need is the right manager and a larger stadium. I am hoping that the new manager will be the right one. Every time I read something about him - from former Spurs players, or players that played under him - it has always been positive. One of Southampton's players said they would rather play for us than Ars*nal because of our manager.
I’ve lived a life that’s full. I’ve travelled each and every highway;
And more, much more than this,
I did it my way.

Regrets, I’ve had a few;
But then again, too few to mention.
I did what I had to do
And saw it through without exemption.

Offline Blackjack

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Re: Are we beaten before we start!!!
« Reply #52 on: July 23, 2014, 10:39:22 PM »
We do have the potential to be a league winning side but due to bad management on all levels and our failure keep our best players and intergrate our potential youth players into regular first team players is our down fall.
SPURS TILL I DIE
DIAMONDS ARE FOREVER SO ARE SPURS.

Offline Paul Finch

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Re: Are we beaten before we start!!!
« Reply #53 on: July 24, 2014, 10:00:10 AM »
Quote from Voice "However, I do agree that hopefully Pochettino can turn Soldado into a very good striker."

     Voice, now come on, you can't be serious, are you saying that Soldado isn't already a very good striker, maybe you mean't to say that Pochettino can turn him into a very good PL striker. :up: :up:
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Offline Glenn R

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Re: Are we beaten before we start!!!
« Reply #54 on: July 24, 2014, 01:00:32 PM »
Quote from Voice "However, I do agree that hopefully Pochettino can turn Soldado into a very good striker."

     Voice, now come on, you can't be serious, are you saying that Soldado isn't already a very good striker, maybe you mean't to say that Pochettino can turn him into a very good PL striker. :up: :up:
That is exactly what I meant. That Pochettino can turn him into a very good PL striker. Well spotted. I am pleased to see that you are on the ball.  :up:  :up: :hide:
I’ve lived a life that’s full. I’ve travelled each and every highway;
And more, much more than this,
I did it my way.

Regrets, I’ve had a few;
But then again, too few to mention.
I did what I had to do
And saw it through without exemption.

Offline RSS61

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Re: Are we beaten before we start!!!
« Reply #55 on: July 25, 2014, 07:51:07 AM »
The sad fact is we are a 2nd tier club. Players want to play in the Champions League so they hold out to see if they can get a move to a CL club. Only once they accept that's not going to happen do they look at the likes of us. That's why we do the majority of our deals late in the window. We are 2nd or 3rd choice to these guys. We will pick up a few young ones who are not yet ready for the CL before hand but the bulk of the business will be done only when the CL clubs have filled their squads.

If we were a second rate club we wouldn't get players like Lloris to join us. We have the potential to be a top 4 club; what we need is the right manager and a larger stadium. I am hoping that the new manager will be the right one. Every time I read something about him - from former Spurs players, or players that played under him - it has always been positive. One of Southampton's players said they would rather play for us than Ars*nal because of our manager.

From what I've seen and heard so far, I think at last we have the right manager. Early days I know, just a feeling. If he can only do one thing this season, and that's sort out our defence once and for all, then we might get somewhere.
The friendlies say it all. 5 goals leaked in 2 games. Ben Davies is a start, now we need at least 1 more CB, and the correct coaching to stop the unforced errors, and how to defend set pieces. Simples !!

Offline RiffHard

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Re: Are we beaten before we start!!!
« Reply #56 on: July 25, 2014, 08:36:03 AM »
The sad fact is we are a 2nd tier club. Players want to play in the Champions League so they hold out to see if they can get a move to a CL club. Only once they accept that's not going to happen do they look at the likes of us. That's why we do the majority of our deals late in the window. We are 2nd or 3rd choice to these guys. We will pick up a few young ones who are not yet ready for the CL before hand but the bulk of the business will be done only when the CL clubs have filled their squads.

If we were a second rate club we wouldn't get players like Lloris to join us. We have the potential to be a top 4 club; what we need is the right manager and a larger stadium. I am hoping that the new manager will be the right one. Every time I read something about him - from former Spurs players, or players that played under him - it has always been positive. One of Southampton's players said they would rather play for us than Ars*nal because of our manager.

From what I've seen and heard so far, I think at last we have the right manager. Early days I know, just a feeling. If he can only do one thing this season, and that's sort out our defence once and for all, then we might get somewhere.
The friendlies say it all. 5 goals leaked in 2 games. Ben Davies is a start, now we need at least 1 more CB, and the correct coaching to stop the unforced errors, and how to defend set pieces. Simples !!
Five leaked goals are a fact, but one must consider that some of these goals were scored when we had reserves on the pitch.

Offline RSS61

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Re: Are we beaten before we start!!!
« Reply #57 on: July 25, 2014, 08:42:27 AM »
It's best not to read too much into preseason results, but they do give an insight into the current strengths and weaknesses of a team.

Manager Mauricio Pochettino's Tottenham side have looked good going forward so far this summer, attacking with much more pace and movement than last season. The midfield are now looking to move the ball forward quickly, and there has been a noticeable increase in the amount of one- and two-touch passing -- though this might just be a byproduct of Mousa Dembele and Paulinho not playing.

Further forward, the movement of the attacking midfield three bodes well for the future. The trio have license to roam, as evidenced by Erik Lamela's two goals against Toronto FC. Starting on the right, Lamela had freedom to drift toward the middle of the field and scored both of his goals from a position on the left.

Spurs have scored three goals in each of their preseason games, but the fact that they have conceded a total of five demonstrates where the problem lies. Against Seattle the team defended abysmally, with keeper Brad Friedel having to pull off a passable impression of Tim Howard against Belgium to keep the score line decent.

- WhoScored: Vorm's move to Spurs makes sense

Tottenham may be linked with players such as Morgan Schneiderlin and Antoine Griezmann, but it would be no disaster if they went into the new season without reinforcements in the midfield and attack.

The defence is a different matter, with more work needing to be done. The club have gone some way to addressing the issues at the back. Ben Davies was brought in to solve the long-running problem at left-back, and Michel Vorm was recruited to provide suitable cover for keeper Hugo Lloris.

Michael Dawson's performances have been woefully off pace, but things aren't as simple as merely replacing him with a younger model. Younes Kaboul also has to prove he can get back to his best because on last season's form, he too is past it. In contrast, Zeki Fryers probably needs more experience before he's ready for more action at Spurs and would benefit from a loan move.

As if that wasn't enough, it is rumoured that Vlad Chiriches could be joining Roma. Though his form declined as last season went on, Chiriches was impressive in his early months at the club. Surely he can't be allowed to leave while Dawson and Kaboul are still there?

You'd think not, but Steven Caulker was sold when it made more sense to offload someone else. Plenty of Tottenham fans don't rate him, yet it's undeniable that he would have seen plenty of first-team action last season. Caulker might never turn out to be a world-beater, but he was available at a relatively modest price this summer. He has potential and, at this stage of his career, is better than Dawson (and most probably Kaboul).

He's also arguably a better bet than Ron Vlaar. The Aston Villa defender had an incredible World Cup and Spurs are currently linked with a move for him. It's an odd link as Vlaar is far too slow to play in Pochettino's system.

Some better options have fallen by the wayside. Dejan Lovren was too expensive and Hector Moreno broke his leg during the World Cup. More candidates must be found fast, because the question is not whether Spurs need to sign a new central defender, but if one will be enough.




I read this on another forum, and for me it sums up our situation exactly.

Offline Paul Finch

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Re: Are we beaten before we start!!!
« Reply #58 on: July 25, 2014, 12:52:38 PM »
It's best not to read too much into preseason results, but they do give an insight into the current strengths and weaknesses of a team.

Manager Mauricio Pochettino's Tottenham side have looked good going forward so far this summer, attacking with much more pace and movement than last season. The midfield are now looking to move the ball forward quickly, and there has been a noticeable increase in the amount of one- and two-touch passing -- though this might just be a byproduct of Mousa Dembele and Paulinho not playing.

Further forward, the movement of the attacking midfield three bodes well for the future. The trio have license to roam, as evidenced by Erik Lamela's two goals against Toronto FC. Starting on the right, Lamela had freedom to drift toward the middle of the field and scored both of his goals from a position on the left.

Spurs have scored three goals in each of their preseason games, but the fact that they have conceded a total of five demonstrates where the problem lies. Against Seattle the team defended abysmally, with keeper Brad Friedel having to pull off a passable impression of Tim Howard against Belgium to keep the score line decent.

- WhoScored: Vorm's move to Spurs makes sense

Tottenham may be linked with players such as Morgan Schneiderlin and Antoine Griezmann, but it would be no disaster if they went into the new season without reinforcements in the midfield and attack.

The defence is a different matter, with more work needing to be done. The club have gone some way to addressing the issues at the back. Ben Davies was brought in to solve the long-running problem at left-back, and Michel Vorm was recruited to provide suitable cover for keeper Hugo Lloris.

Michael Dawson's performances have been woefully off pace, but things aren't as simple as merely replacing him with a younger model. Younes Kaboul also has to prove he can get back to his best because on last season's form, he too is past it. In contrast, Zeki Fryers probably needs more experience before he's ready for more action at Spurs and would benefit from a loan move.

As if that wasn't enough, it is rumoured that Vlad Chiriches could be joining Roma. Though his form declined as last season went on, Chiriches was impressive in his early months at the club. Surely he can't be allowed to leave while Dawson and Kaboul are still there?

You'd think not, but Steven Caulker was sold when it made more sense to offload someone else. Plenty of Tottenham fans don't rate him, yet it's undeniable that he would have seen plenty of first-team action last season. Caulker might never turn out to be a world-beater, but he was available at a relatively modest price this summer. He has potential and, at this stage of his career, is better than Dawson (and most probably Kaboul).

He's also arguably a better bet than Ron Vlaar. The Aston Villa defender had an incredible World Cup and Spurs are currently linked with a move for him. It's an odd link as Vlaar is far too slow to play in Pochettino's system.

Some better options have fallen by the wayside. Dejan Lovren was too expensive and Hector Moreno broke his leg during the World Cup. More candidates must be found fast, because the question is not whether Spurs need to sign a new central defender, but if one will be enough.




I read this on another forum, and for me it sums up our situation exactly.


  RSS, I couldn't agree more with your summation of our current form, BUT, if and I say IF Verthongen does stay, the signing of Davies will allow him(Verthongen) to play in his favored position of CB which would mean that either Kaboul or Chiriches or Capoue could partner him which might just be another alternative. Agree or disagree ?? :-\ :-\
:SN:[font

Offline RSS61

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Re: Are we beaten before we start!!!
« Reply #59 on: July 25, 2014, 03:54:44 PM »
It's best not to read too much into preseason results, but they do give an insight into the current strengths and weaknesses of a team.

Manager Mauricio Pochettino's Tottenham side have looked good going forward so far this summer, attacking with much more pace and movement than last season. The midfield are now looking to move the ball forward quickly, and there has been a noticeable increase in the amount of one- and two-touch passing -- though this might just be a byproduct of Mousa Dembele and Paulinho not playing.

Further forward, the movement of the attacking midfield three bodes well for the future. The trio have license to roam, as evidenced by Erik Lamela's two goals against Toronto FC. Starting on the right, Lamela had freedom to drift toward the middle of the field and scored both of his goals from a position on the left.

Spurs have scored three goals in each of their preseason games, but the fact that they have conceded a total of five demonstrates where the problem lies. Against Seattle the team defended abysmally, with keeper Brad Friedel having to pull off a passable impression of Tim Howard against Belgium to keep the score line decent.

- WhoScored: Vorm's move to Spurs makes sense

Tottenham may be linked with players such as Morgan Schneiderlin and Antoine Griezmann, but it would be no disaster if they went into the new season without reinforcements in the midfield and attack.

The defence is a different matter, with more work needing to be done. The club have gone some way to addressing the issues at the back. Ben Davies was brought in to solve the long-running problem at left-back, and Michel Vorm was recruited to provide suitable cover for keeper Hugo Lloris.

Michael Dawson's performances have been woefully off pace, but things aren't as simple as merely replacing him with a younger model. Younes Kaboul also has to prove he can get back to his best because on last season's form, he too is past it. In contrast, Zeki Fryers probably needs more experience before he's ready for more action at Spurs and would benefit from a loan move.

As if that wasn't enough, it is rumoured that Vlad Chiriches could be joining Roma. Though his form declined as last season went on, Chiriches was impressive in his early months at the club. Surely he can't be allowed to leave while Dawson and Kaboul are still there?

You'd think not, but Steven Caulker was sold when it made more sense to offload someone else. Plenty of Tottenham fans don't rate him, yet it's undeniable that he would have seen plenty of first-team action last season. Caulker might never turn out to be a world-beater, but he was available at a relatively modest price this summer. He has potential and, at this stage of his career, is better than Dawson (and most probably Kaboul).

He's also arguably a better bet than Ron Vlaar. The Aston Villa defender had an incredible World Cup and Spurs are currently linked with a move for him. It's an odd link as Vlaar is far too slow to play in Pochettino's system.

Some better options have fallen by the wayside. Dejan Lovren was too expensive and Hector Moreno broke his leg during the World Cup. More candidates must be found fast, because the question is not whether Spurs need to sign a new central defender, but if one will be enough.




I read this on another forum, and for me it sums up our situation exactly.


  RSS, I couldn't agree more with your summation of our current form, BUT, if and I say IF Verthongen does stay, the signing of Davies will allow him(Verthongen) to play in his favored position of CB which would mean that either Kaboul or Chiriches or Capoue could partner him which might just be another alternative. Agree or disagree ?? :-\ :-\

I always felt that JVT and Kaboul would be our best CB partnership. Providing Kaboul can stay fit, then I still do. Dawson is finished, Ceriches is forever injured, is error prone, and apparently unhappy anyway.
Either way we need at least 1 more CB and Pochettino would appear to be after one.