SpursNetwork
Tottenham Discussion => Spurs Chat => Topic started by: Blackjack on March 08, 2014, 10:16:55 AM
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I have started this thread to get everyones thoughts on how they see we are going and what they feel has happened since last season and beyond?.
Il start, I believe the we are in decline :( , this happened when we got rid of Harry, under him we played fast flowing, attractive football, great to watch, had some fantastic players and I felt it was exciting times at Tottenham then!, we achieved champions league football for the first time and there was a really good feel factor to being a Spurs fan. :) With the likes of Bale, Vandervarrt, Modric we had players that could make a difference in important games!,, we got to the CL quater finals in our debut season another fantastic achievement!, we even finnished top 4 again with Harry but due to matters out of our control we never qualified for the CL, VERY VERY UNLUCKY on our part!, still something to be proud of!. BUT!!!! to our chairmen this was not good enough!, he saw fit to remove Harry and instate his own manager in an attempt to take us further forward! WRONG DECISION!!!, any way, we soon become aware of Bale will be sold at the end of the season! WRONG DECISION!!!, also by now we had already lost Modric & RVT, in comes AVB with his new ideas!, all very well in that we recorded our highest league points tall in the PL :up: , things are looking up..MAY BE!.
Come the summer and a new preseason no Bale? injured, YEAH WHATEVER! :2funny: , suddenly Spurs have over 100m to spend ...hmmm where did that come from? why was Harry never given that kind of money? hmmm, in comes 7 new players! BLIMEY, we are actually going to make a charge this season GREAT :) :) :) , Bale then is sold as we all expected but never wanted to happen and we start look at these 7 new players! Soldado proven Valencia striker.. GREAT thats more like it!, Paulinho, brilliant now we got some grit in midfield!, Lamela WHO? up and coming youngster who is going to be the next Marradona!, ok well we will see about that!!!, Erikksen, well respected playmaker chased by Pool among others, Great that replaces Modric!, Chadli young winger. WHO?,Capouee, WHO? Holtby another young up coming talented midfielder, so we have this new selection of players and the new season starts with great anticipation :D , we get off to some winning results but it is clear to see we are way to defencive! , one up front and midfield players everywhere!, ok we think its just a bedding in time! but wait a min, should we really be altering so many players into a team that was already very good? NO.
The team continues and they are getting worse by the game!, us fans are not content at this passive style of football, we have the lowest goals scored and we are now getting hammered by teams!, our lone striker is starved of service our manger has a personal disagreement with another striker and will not play him and throws him in the reserves!, our little fox in the box Defoe is benched and just cant get a game! the team is changed and changed and changed, never a same 11 twice!!!, things have taken a 180 degrees U TURN.
The manager is insisting things are fine, suggestions are made that the players brought in where bought for him by the chairman and director of football which the manger denies? REALLY! SERIOUSLY!! COUGH COUGH,
AVB still persist in playing this forein style of football, that just does not suit Spurs, plus we dont have the likes of Silva, Fabregas,Messi, who can play intrigute passing!, we have a team of players just cramping up in midfield and playing rebound of every back four in the PL!, our wingers have been given liscence to go where they want!, EVERY WHERE BUT WHERE THEY NEED TO BE...ON THE WING!!! :( , Our striker is playing the lone ranger doing nothing as he is getting nothing!, our midfield has no clue what to do as they can not move without running into a team mate!, when they dont have the ball they back off and look lost waiting for another team mate to do something!. our defence has no outlet to play the ball forward because the midfield is static and man marked and so they go deeper into there own half! all in all a team with no leadership on the pitch and of it.CHAOS :-[ :-[ :-[ .
AVB is removed!!! hal lay lou ya!!!,in comes Tim who is old school and goes back to basics, two up front and gets some orginisation back in the team and results pick up... :) :) :) , but why have we had to go backwards? why dismantle a very good team in the first place? the team Tim has now is ok but not great!, some of the players brought in are not good enough and do not play in the positions we most need, we need another winger/s with pace to take men on and get to the byline and whip balls into the striker!, we need players with much better ball control who can pass and move, we need a leader. a Roy Keane to get into the players and motivate them, but most of all we need to replace quality with quality!, under Harry he got RVT, we need to be getting the best to be the best!, if we keep buying seconds thirds then thats where we will stay :-[ .
Daniel Levy is accountable for this, he should have invested with Harry but know he wanted a yes man a puppet/ robot who he can control!, he might as well be the manager as he decides who plays and who dont and for this reason Spurs will never be great again :-[ :-[ :-[ .
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Blackjack,
Congratulations on a very well thought out and excellent summation of the last two and a half seasons, in my opinion, you are 100% correct, it will be interesting to see who disagrees and argues against what you have posted.
:up: :up: :up: :up:
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Good thread, Blackjack. I am just not totally in agreement with you regarding Harry!
I will think about my answers on that.
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I agree with your hypothesis. The next question is what do we do next? Another manager at the end of the season and we start all over again? Or do we continue with Sherwood?
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Today just highlighted exactly what ive said!, we are only good for one thing at present..giving up :-[ :-[ :-[ , if ever there was a reason we need a leader on the pitch its now!, we have the look of a relegated side as soon as things go tits up!,. In todays match we play a half of containment and try to counter but the second half one mistake and we give up!, there is no fight in our team, no grit, gut, desire to win when losing!, this is whats happens when you try to change things to quickly!, Tim said in the interview after the match how we were guttless and to soft with each other and are afraid to tell a friend what to do, that is spot on by the manager and it needs to be said! he even said were are nowhere near a top 4 team!,. Marinho even said Spurs are a good side with possesion but dont really hurt you!!! :-[ , spot on again, our team is in danger of becoming a bunch of fairies :( , some of you may disagree but it needs to be said!, our team at present are a shambles when it comes to playing better teams or facing a losing match!... they are mentaly wrong! physicaly wrong and even playing football wrong! they make school boy errors not once but many times in a single match, leadership has to be our up most priority now second by some sever back to basic training which I keep saying over and over!. I see the desire in Sherwood and I think he is on my wave length but I dont know whether the players believe in him or themelves!. Something needs to be done and quickly, never have I seen our team get hammered so many times in one single season! I hope Mr LEVY you are reading this because you set the balls in motion, your big ego and stubbon mindedness has changed a good team going great into a great team going CRAP!!!,, there is a saying Mr Levy you should have thought about before you decided to ring the changes...IF ITS NOT BROKEN DONT FIX IT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!.
Now Mr Levy you got us in this mess you bloody well get us out of it! GO BUY SOME REAL QUALITY PLAYERS before we become a team that couldnt even qualify for Europe let alone the champions league....REALLY REALLY GETTING ANNOYED NOW OUR TEAM ARE AN EMBARRESMENT!!, NEVER DID I THINK I WOULD SAY THAT ABOUT MY BELOVED SPURS. :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'(
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I cant wait for this season to end. We have been dire. Even when we win we look poor. There is no flair no real excitement and some, at times, comical defending. We can forget qualifying for The Champions League, at this rate we will be lucky to make The Europa again. Tim Sherwood seems like a decent guy but he wont be Manager next season that's a certainty. Whoever comes in will have his work cut out. A lot of players will be wanting out and very few of any quality will be keen to come. We are going to be looking at another season at least of what is becoming a permanent period of transition. Which is a contradiction in terms but we seem to have managed to do it. We have good players what we don't have is a good team and it would seem the team spirit isn't what it was. Somehow through all this we are 5th we should be delighted, a few years ago we would have been ecstatic to be so high up the table but I feel embarrassed and ashamed at times. Losing to the top teams is not unusual but the manner of the defeats has been a disgrace we have capitulated to often and yesterdays game was the final straw for me. I'm going to write this season off and hopefully come back with renewed enthusiasm in the summer.
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Blackjack, a refreshing, well thought out and put together post which I hope will create some great debate :up:.
This is how I see our transition over recent years and why our position now is a greater concern than the Ramos saga!
Jol started our drive towards top 4, got dumped on by Levy as Comolli had is ear and in came Ramos, with the same players won us the league cup straight away but then the following season had us routed to the foot of the table with i think 2 points from 8 games, playing dire, with no flair, passion or ability. In comes Arry and with the same crop of players gets us to finish 8th that season, awesome.
Now starts the excitement and belief which amounts to a spurs team which both players and supporters feel can challenge and beat anyone. During this time a few players come in, ones which I would call world beaters on their day such and can turn a match such as Modric, VDV, Bale develops and other bargain buys adding to the talented crop we already have which have us pushing for and sitting in the top 4 regularly, they also get us in CL footi resulting in us getting into the quarter final on our first and only outing to date in the comp.
Arry goes, mainly for refusing to sign a new contract as Levy wanted to fend of England, Arry believes the media hype thinks he has the job, doesn't get it then comes back to Levy we know the rest! Maybe if Levy had showed faith in Arry prior to the England speculation and given him funds to invest Arry may not have had his head turned and that season may have ended very differently, but that is just an opinion and impossible to second guess.
We are now in a very different position in my opinion to the Ramos saga, our team that was showing promise of greatness has been totally dismantled with 3/4 of it being now players that do not and so far can not play together, our flair and risk to the opposition has totally disappeared. We also have a bunch of players now who are not Spurs players through and through, they want success and to be challenging for honors so I expect most if not all new arrivals to be wanting out at the end of the season, resulting in us starting from scratch and loosing a lot of money! I also fear the likes of Walker, JVT and Lloris will be looking else where for their careers.
I think many of the transfers made was Levy sending a message out that we Spurs can spend big and buy players we want, if all were asked for by AVB then he was a moron but I really don't think that was the case as many that have come in were intended to be an "investment".
Our current position, a share of the blame lies in many areas, such as players, AVB, Baldini, Levy (again) and TS. Levy is a great business man but he has to accept he has made countless errors over recent seasons which has culminated in our current position which I fear next season if it continues from the outset we will be in the wrong half of the table.
For me though Levy has to now shoulder most of the responsibility and blame, Baldini again hasn't worked out, Levys relationships with managers always go south, and managers are not afforded time or suitable support.
Where do we go from here, well TBH I dont want TS at the helm, not experienced enough for what we want to achieve, its apparent he can not motivate the players nor does he have the vision tactics wise and as such I also feel players don't respect what he has achieved as a player or manager, not much to look up to or listen to from their perspective!
Gaal would be a manager that has done the lot and may suit us and may convince some players to stay and get the best out of them, either way next season we will be starting all over again be it new manager and players, or new manager same players or same manager new players (this option is the worst case senario and we will be in the EPL foundations if this happens) for me with another season of transition and changes, aren't we a lucky lot.
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Some well thought out points from everyone. I feel that the common denominator in all of this is Levy. We have had god knows how many managers over the last 10-20 years. Surely they cannot all
be that bad ?
I agree the point made that Harry was unfortunately the author of his own downfall. He should have gone public and said thanks for all the speculation over the England job, but I have a job to do here at Tottenham. Levy is not a man to be turned down and then change his mind when it suited Harry to want it.
Without doubt, Harry had the experience to take a bunch of underperformers and make something of them.
After yesterdays debacle, Tim for me is too inexperienced to undertake such a difficult job.
So where does that leave us ?? For me, until Levy is removed, then our problems will go on and on. We have a group of players, who I have said on numerous occasions simply are not good enough. Tim's outburst yesterday, while not the sort of thing a manager should be saying in public, was right on the money. I feel he now realises that he has tried everything with this lot and none of it has worked.
Unfortunately for Tim, history tells us he will be sacked in the summer.
Whoever is manager then needs to try and keep the nucleous of our better players, such as Lloris JVT Kaboul Cherices Sandro Erikson Adebayor Paulinho and quite frankly thats about it. We meed 2
Full backs 2 wingers amd 2 strikers if we are to have any hope of turning things around.
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Its great to see so many other fellow supporters on a similar wave length to me!, we ofton think about it but I know myself that I dont always speak about it! we are always looking up at Ars*nal, Chelsea, MU and we hate it but recently we started to get hope that we were reaching there standard and might just push on and have a go for the title :) . But there is no chance of that now, I would love to say its ok and we will turn it around but with our current squad I dont see where the inspiration is going to come from!.
There is no quick fix here!, even with a new manager where or how does he do it? what little quality we do have as have been said already will probably go so short of a multi billionaire coming in like MC and buying everybody how do we get out of this mess?, who will want to come? probably players struggling in there team will use Spurs as a stepping stone to move on to better things!, we dont need anymore of that, the world beaters want CL football and we cant give them that!, honestly what carrot does spurs offer? sweat F.A! :-[ , . This team used to be great!, even a great cup side! now we are neither!, the currnt players should take a long long look at themselves and of the great players who have graced the great shirt before!, they should look upto them and use this as a spring board to motivate themselves to give that little extra! it only takes 1or 2 to show that desire and others will follow, unfortunatly in todays game its not about playing the game you love for the club you love its about indervidules only looking out for number 1 and this is why we fail.
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Its great to see so many other fellow supporters on a similar wave length to me!, we ofton think about it but I know myself that I dont always speak about it! we are always looking up at Ars*nal, Chelsea, MU and we hate it but recently we started to get hope that we were reaching there standard and might just push on and have a go for the title :) . But there is no chance of that now, I would love to say its ok and we will turn it around but with our current squad I dont see where the inspiration is going to come from!.
There is no quick fix here!, even with a new manager where or how does he do it? what little quality we do have as have been said already will probably go so short of a multi billionaire coming in like MC and buying everybody how do we get out of this mess?, who will want to come? probably players struggling in there team will use Spurs as a stepping stone to move on to better things!, we dont need anymore of that, the world beaters want CL football and we cant give them that!, honestly what carrot does spurs offer? sweat F.A! :-[ , . This team used to be great!, even a great cup side! now we are neither!, the currnt players should take a long long look at themselves and of the great players who have graced the great shirt before!, they should look upto them and use this as a spring board to motivate themselves to give that little extra! it only takes 1or 2 to show that desire and others will follow, unfortunatly in todays game its not about playing the game you love for the club you love its about indervidules only looking out for number 1 and this is why we fail.
Thats the thing with todays football players you say they should take a long hard look at themselves, I totally agree but so many just dont give a shyte.
They get their mega wage regardless of performance week in and week out, many know other teams would fall over themselves to have them it is a really difficult situation that we are in.
We need a head coach or manager to pull things together, motivate they players and turn them around so they believe their future is at THFC, and for Levy to either back fully and allow them time and funds to develop the squad and first team or step aside and let someone else have a crack.
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Well done Blackjack, glad you decided to start this thread and have put your points across really well too.
Actually everyone for once seems to be saying very similar points with slights variations of course, so well done everyone. I think the reality of what has happened has sunk in to even the hardiest of Harry haters. Not that we need to get into the Harry debate again, but the evidence for what has happened since is clear for everyone to see.
I felt that sacking Harry at the time was completely crazy, regardless of the England situation, where we were as a side was playing the best football I have seen in my lifetime, with a real belief and renewed passion in my club. At last it looked like we were going places. In fact it wasn't really the sacking that bothered me, so much, it was the way it was done that really gave me a foreboding vision of the future. It demonstrated a lack of respect and appreciation for the manager that really put us on the world map. It also disrespected the fans who did like him and would have wanted him to continue. However, even I let this go, (too easily in my opinion) but I did. I gave the benefit of the doubt and waited with anticipation for our next chapter. Maybe, just maybe, we were going to keep moving onward and upwards and the decision would be proven right.
Now if we had gotten a Mourinho or an Ancelotti, or a Guardiola or the like then it may have worked. If we had a top manager, and replaced modric and VDV, then Bale may have even stayed. But if he did not, then those managers would have brought in the kind of players we needed to move on without him.
I have been calling for Levy to step down for a while now and I think it will only be this action that will give us the chance to move on in the right direction. He is the central cause of all of our problems and needs to step aside, or seriously step back and let those that know, do.
I agree with Blackjack's analysis of the side. I would also throw into the mix the loss of Parker. Yes, he wasn't a big name, big money signing, but we seriously miss his grit, determination and leadership on the pitch. So I would add a CM to the list of players we need. Yes, it will mean losing one of our current bunch, but to build a team, you need team players.
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Well done Blackjack, glad you decided to start this thread and have put your points across really well too.
Actually everyone for once seems to be saying very similar points with slights variations of course, so well done everyone. I think the reality of what has happened has sunk in to even the hardiest of Harry haters. Not that we need to get into the Harry debate again, but the evidence for what has happened since is clear for everyone to see.
I felt that sacking Harry at the time was completely crazy, regardless of the England situation, where we were as a side was playing the best football I have seen in my lifetime, with a real belief and renewed passion in my club. At last it looked like we were going places. In fact it wasn't really the sacking that bothered me, so much, it was the way it was done that really gave me a foreboding vision of the future. It demonstrated a lack of respect and appreciation for the manager that really put us on the world map. It also disrespected the fans who did like him and would have wanted him to continue. However, even I let this go, (too easily in my opinion) but I did. I gave the benefit of the doubt and waited with anticipation for our next chapter. Maybe, just maybe, we were going to keep moving onward and upwards and the decision would be proven right.
Now if we had gotten a Mourinho or an Ancelotti, or a Guardiola or the like then it may have worked. If we had a top manager, and replaced modric and VDV, then Bale may have even stayed. But if he did not, then those managers would have brought in the kind of players we needed to move on without him.
I have been calling for Levy to step down for a while now and I think it will only be this action that will give us the chance to move on in the right direction. He is the central cause of all of our problems and needs to step aside, or seriously step back and let those that know, do.
I agree with Blackjack's analysis of the side. I would also throw into the mix the loss of Parker. Yes, he wasn't a big name, big money signing, but we seriously miss his grit, determination and leadership on the pitch. So I would add a CM to the list of players we need. Yes, it will mean losing one of our current bunch, but to build a team, you need team players.
Personally I believe, like many others, that sacking Harry was a massive mistake, whether some of you like it or not, Spurs as a Club were really starting to go somewhere with Harry and his Coaching team at the Helm, I do not, like some, believe that he had taken us as far as he was capable of, had Levy have given him the funds, we would not be in the position that we now find ourselves, cast your minds back, Harry was never given the money to buy quality players, but the players he did buy were quality players, which he bought at bargain prices (VDV 8 Mil, Parker 5.5 Mil, Crouch 9 Mil, Kranjcar 2 Mil, Bassong 8 Mil, Defoe 15.75 Mil to name 6) everyone of them QUALITY PLAYERS bought for a total of 48 million pounds and I do not recall him complaining about it once, apart from when in Jan 2012 when he had to sign two players on free transfers because Levy wouldn't make available funds for him to strengthen the squad, imagine the type of players he would have signed given 100 million pounds to spend, the mind boggles, and I guarantee you this he would get the players now at Spurs playing as a Team, can you imagine Redknapp and Joe Jordan letting them get away with the 2nd half performance that they served up on Sat, because I can't.
I was always against the appointment of AVB and I was vocal about it, people on here are saying that TS has no experience as a coach but at least he has played at the top level, and has a PL Championship medal to show for it, and more importantly he played for SPURS, AVB NEVER played the game, his experience as a Senior Coach was 1Yr, yes 1 year in Portugal, and 8 mths at Chelsea who fired him, then Levy appoints him at Spurs. What a F-----G JOKE. Quite frankly I do not give a flying F--K that he achieved our highest points tally in the PL last season it got us nothing, nada, zero, in doing it we played some of the most BORING, UNATTRACTIVE and NEGATIVE football I have ever seen SPURS play, and I have been watching Spurs for 60 years.
Whether you like it or not under Redknapp we would be pushing for the Title instead of a Europa Cup place(which at present looks beyond our reach).
>:( >:( >:( >:( >:( >:( :-[ :-[ :-[ :-[ :-[ :( :( :( :( :(
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Well done Blackjack, glad you decided to start this thread and have put your points across really well too.
Actually everyone for once seems to be saying very similar points with slights variations of course, so well done everyone. I think the reality of what has happened has sunk in to even the hardiest of Harry haters. Not that we need to get into the Harry debate again, but the evidence for what has happened since is clear for everyone to see.
I felt that sacking Harry at the time was completely crazy, regardless of the England situation, where we were as a side was playing the best football I have seen in my lifetime, with a real belief and renewed passion in my club. At last it looked like we were going places. In fact it wasn't really the sacking that bothered me, so much, it was the way it was done that really gave me a foreboding vision of the future. It demonstrated a lack of respect and appreciation for the manager that really put us on the world map. It also disrespected the fans who did like him and would have wanted him to continue. However, even I let this go, (too easily in my opinion) but I did. I gave the benefit of the doubt and waited with anticipation for our next chapter. Maybe, just maybe, we were going to keep moving onward and upwards and the decision would be proven right.
Now if we had gotten a Mourinho or an Ancelotti, or a Guardiola or the like then it may have worked. If we had a top manager, and replaced modric and VDV, then Bale may have even stayed. But if he did not, then those managers would have brought in the kind of players we needed to move on without him.
I have been calling for Levy to step down for a while now and I think it will only be this action that will give us the chance to move on in the right direction. He is the central cause of all of our problems and needs to step aside, or seriously step back and let those that know, do.
I agree with Blackjack's analysis of the side. I would also throw into the mix the loss of Parker. Yes, he wasn't a big name, big money signing, but we seriously miss his grit, determination and leadership on the pitch. So I would add a CM to the list of players we need. Yes, it will mean losing one of our current bunch, but to build a team, you need team players.
Personally I believe, like many others, that sacking Harry was a massive mistake, whether some of you like it or not, Spurs as a Club were really starting to go somewhere with Harry and his Coaching team at the Helm, I do not, like some, believe that he had taken us as far as he was capable of, had Levy have given him the funds, we would not be in the position that we now find ourselves, cast your minds back, Harry was never given the money to buy quality players, but the players he did buy were quality players, which he bought at bargain prices (VDV 8 Mil, Parker 5.5 Mil, Crouch 9 Mil, Kranjcar 2 Mil, Bassong 8 Mil, Defoe 15.75 Mil to name 6) everyone of them QUALITY PLAYERS bought for a total of 48 million pounds and I do not recall him complaining about it once, apart from when in Jan 2012 when he had to sign two players on free transfers because Levy wouldn't make available funds for him to strengthen the squad, imagine the type of players he would have signed given 100 million pounds to spend, the mind boggles, and I guarantee you this he would get the players now at Spurs playing as a Team, can you imagine Redknapp and Joe Jordan letting them get away with the 2nd half performance that they served up on Sat, because I can't.
I was always against the appointment of AVB and I was vocal about it, people on here are saying that TS has no experience as a coach but at least he has played at the top level, and has a PL Championship medal to show for it, and more importantly he played for SPURS, AVB NEVER played the game, his experience as a Senior Coach was 1Yr, yes 1 year in Portugal, and 8 mths at Chelsea who fired him, then Levy appoints him at Spurs. What a F-----G JOKE. Quite frankly I do not give a flying F--K that he achieved our highest points tally in the PL last season it got us nothing, nada, zero, in doing it we played some of the most BORING, UNATTRACTIVE and NEGATIVE football I have ever seen SPURS play, and I have been watching Spurs for 60 years.
Whether you like it or not under Redknapp we would be pushing for the Title instead of a Europa Cup place(which at present looks beyond our reach).
>:( >:( >:( >:( >:( >:( :-[ :-[ :-[ :-[ :-[ :( :( :( :( :(
With regards to Redknapp, yes, albeit with hindsight, you are correct. However will we ever be told the truth about what went on during January 2012, with his court case, and the speculation over the England job, and the REAL reason why he was sacked ???
If Levy had any decency, then he owes it to us Spurs fans to be honest and tell us what went wrong then.
But he wont, and he should also be sacked.
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RSS61,
I couldn't agree more, not only do we need to know, I think as Spurs supporters we are entitled to know, unfortunately because we are not shareholders or dare I say it, putting copious amounts of money into the club, we will never know. I have said for the last 2 yrs, that LEVY should either take a step back and allow FOOTBALL people to make the FOOTBALL decisions or resign because clearly when it comes to FOOTBALL decisions he(LEVY) doesn't have a clue. >:( >:( >:(
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Well done Blackjack, glad you decided to start this thread and have put your points across really well too.
Actually everyone for once seems to be saying very similar points with slights variations of course, so well done everyone. I think the reality of what has happened has sunk in to even the hardiest of Harry haters. Not that we need to get into the Harry debate again, but the evidence for what has happened since is clear for everyone to see.
I felt that sacking Harry at the time was completely crazy, regardless of the England situation, where we were as a side was playing the best football I have seen in my lifetime, with a real belief and renewed passion in my club. At last it looked like we were going places. In fact it wasn't really the sacking that bothered me, so much, it was the way it was done that really gave me a foreboding vision of the future. It demonstrated a lack of respect and appreciation for the manager that really put us on the world map. It also disrespected the fans who did like him and would have wanted him to continue. However, even I let this go, (too easily in my opinion) but I did. I gave the benefit of the doubt and waited with anticipation for our next chapter. Maybe, just maybe, we were going to keep moving onward and upwards and the decision would be proven right.
Now if we had gotten a Mourinho or an Ancelotti, or a Guardiola or the like then it may have worked. If we had a top manager, and replaced modric and VDV, then Bale may have even stayed. But if he did not, then those managers would have brought in the kind of players we needed to move on without him.
I have been calling for Levy to step down for a while now and I think it will only be this action that will give us the chance to move on in the right direction. He is the central cause of all of our problems and needs to step aside, or seriously step back and let those that know, do.
I agree with Blackjack's analysis of the side. I would also throw into the mix the loss of Parker. Yes, he wasn't a big name, big money signing, but we seriously miss his grit, determination and leadership on the pitch. So I would add a CM to the list of players we need. Yes, it will mean losing one of our current bunch, but to build a team, you need team players.
Personally I believe, like many others, that sacking Harry was a massive mistake, whether some of you like it or not, Spurs as a Club were really starting to go somewhere with Harry and his Coaching team at the Helm, I do not, like some, believe that he had taken us as far as he was capable of, had Levy have given him the funds, we would not be in the position that we now find ourselves, cast your minds back, Harry was never given the money to buy quality players, but the players he did buy were quality players, which he bought at bargain prices (VDV 8 Mil, Parker 5.5 Mil, Crouch 9 Mil, Kranjcar 2 Mil, Bassong 8 Mil, Defoe 15.75 Mil to name 6) everyone of them QUALITY PLAYERS bought for a total of 48 million pounds and I do not recall him complaining about it once, apart from when in Jan 2012 when he had to sign two players on free transfers because Levy wouldn't make available funds for him to strengthen the squad, imagine the type of players he would have signed given 100 million pounds to spend, the mind boggles, and I guarantee you this he would get the players now at Spurs playing as a Team, can you imagine Redknapp and Joe Jordan letting them get away with the 2nd half performance that they served up on Sat, because I can't.
I was always against the appointment of AVB and I was vocal about it, people on here are saying that TS has no experience as a coach but at least he has played at the top level, and has a PL Championship medal to show for it, and more importantly he played for SPURS, AVB NEVER played the game, his experience as a Senior Coach was 1Yr, yes 1 year in Portugal, and 8 mths at Chelsea who fired him, then Levy appoints him at Spurs. What a F-----G JOKE. Quite frankly I do not give a flying F--K that he achieved our highest points tally in the PL last season it got us nothing, nada, zero, in doing it we played some of the most BORING, UNATTRACTIVE and NEGATIVE football I have ever seen SPURS play, and I have been watching Spurs for 60 years.
Whether you like it or not under Redknapp we would be pushing for the Title instead of a Europa Cup place(which at present looks beyond our reach).
>:( >:( >:( >:( >:( >:( :-[ :-[ :-[ :-[ :-[ :( :( :( :( :(
With regards to Redknapp, yes, albeit with hindsight, you are correct. However will we ever be told the truth about what went on during January 2012, with his court case, and the speculation over the England job, and the REAL reason why he was sacked ???
If Levy had any decency, then he owes it to us Spurs fans to be honest and tell us what went wrong then.
But he wont, and he should also be sacked.
But does any top club director tell us what is going on? And even if Levy got the sack would the new man be any more forthcoming? I doubt it. We could sack him and get somebody like the Vincent Tan. Then we would be praying for Levy to come back.
Remember; power and money means arrogance and not kowtowing to the minions; i.e. us. We have our place, paying for the tickets and loyally supporting our club. Beyond that; nothing. Sack Levy and you will get the same.
-
Well done Blackjack, glad you decided to start this thread and have put your points across really well too.
Actually everyone for once seems to be saying very similar points with slights variations of course, so well done everyone. I think the reality of what has happened has sunk in to even the hardiest of Harry haters. Not that we need to get into the Harry debate again, but the evidence for what has happened since is clear for everyone to see.
I felt that sacking Harry at the time was completely crazy, regardless of the England situation, where we were as a side was playing the best football I have seen in my lifetime, with a real belief and renewed passion in my club. At last it looked like we were going places. In fact it wasn't really the sacking that bothered me, so much, it was the way it was done that really gave me a foreboding vision of the future. It demonstrated a lack of respect and appreciation for the manager that really put us on the world map. It also disrespected the fans who did like him and would have wanted him to continue. However, even I let this go, (too easily in my opinion) but I did. I gave the benefit of the doubt and waited with anticipation for our next chapter. Maybe, just maybe, we were going to keep moving onward and upwards and the decision would be proven right.
Now if we had gotten a Mourinho or an Ancelotti, or a Guardiola or the like then it may have worked. If we had a top manager, and replaced modric and VDV, then Bale may have even stayed. But if he did not, then those managers would have brought in the kind of players we needed to move on without him.
I have been calling for Levy to step down for a while now and I think it will only be this action that will give us the chance to move on in the right direction. He is the central cause of all of our problems and needs to step aside, or seriously step back and let those that know, do.
I agree with Blackjack's analysis of the side. I would also throw into the mix the loss of Parker. Yes, he wasn't a big name, big money signing, but we seriously miss his grit, determination and leadership on the pitch. So I would add a CM to the list of players we need. Yes, it will mean losing one of our current bunch, but to build a team, you need team players.
Personally I believe, like many others, that sacking Harry was a massive mistake, whether some of you like it or not, Spurs as a Club were really starting to go somewhere with Harry and his Coaching team at the Helm, I do not, like some, believe that he had taken us as far as he was capable of, had Levy have given him the funds, we would not be in the position that we now find ourselves, cast your minds back, Harry was never given the money to buy quality players, but the players he did buy were quality players, which he bought at bargain prices (VDV 8 Mil, Parker 5.5 Mil, Crouch 9 Mil, Kranjcar 2 Mil, Bassong 8 Mil, Defoe 15.75 Mil to name 6) everyone of them QUALITY PLAYERS bought for a total of 48 million pounds and I do not recall him complaining about it once, apart from when in Jan 2012 when he had to sign two players on free transfers because Levy wouldn't make available funds for him to strengthen the squad, imagine the type of players he would have signed given 100 million pounds to spend, the mind boggles, and I guarantee you this he would get the players now at Spurs playing as a Team, can you imagine Redknapp and Joe Jordan letting them get away with the 2nd half performance that they served up on Sat, because I can't.
I was always against the appointment of AVB and I was vocal about it, people on here are saying that TS has no experience as a coach but at least he has played at the top level, and has a PL Championship medal to show for it, and more importantly he played for SPURS, AVB NEVER played the game, his experience as a Senior Coach was 1Yr, yes 1 year in Portugal, and 8 mths at Chelsea who fired him, then Levy appoints him at Spurs. What a F-----G JOKE. Quite frankly I do not give a flying F--K that he achieved our highest points tally in the PL last season it got us nothing, nada, zero, in doing it we played some of the most BORING, UNATTRACTIVE and NEGATIVE football I have ever seen SPURS play, and I have been watching Spurs for 60 years.
Whether you like it or not under Redknapp we would be pushing for the Title instead of a Europa Cup place(which at present looks beyond our reach).
>:( >:( >:( >:( >:( >:( :-[ :-[ :-[ :-[ :-[ :( :( :( :( :(
With regards to Redknapp, yes, albeit with hindsight, you are correct. However will we ever be told the truth about what went on during January 2012, with his court case, and the speculation over the England job, and the REAL reason why he was sacked ???
If Levy had any decency, then he owes it to us Spurs fans to be honest and tell us what went wrong then.
But he wont, and he should also be sacked.
But does any top club director tell us what is going on? And even if Levy got the sack would the new man be any more forthcoming? I doubt it. We could sack him and get somebody like the Vincent Tan. Then we would be praying for Levy to come back.
Remember; power and money means arrogance and not kowtowing to the minions; i.e. us. We have our place, paying for the tickets and loyally supporting our club. Beyond that; nothing. Sack Levy and you will get the same.
Surely somebody has to be held to account for the debacle that has occurred ??
-
Well done Blackjack, glad you decided to start this thread and have put your points across really well too.
Actually everyone for once seems to be saying very similar points with slights variations of course, so well done everyone. I think the reality of what has happened has sunk in to even the hardiest of Harry haters. Not that we need to get into the Harry debate again, but the evidence for what has happened since is clear for everyone to see.
I felt that sacking Harry at the time was completely crazy, regardless of the England situation, where we were as a side was playing the best football I have seen in my lifetime, with a real belief and renewed passion in my club. At last it looked like we were going places. In fact it wasn't really the sacking that bothered me, so much, it was the way it was done that really gave me a foreboding vision of the future. It demonstrated a lack of respect and appreciation for the manager that really put us on the world map. It also disrespected the fans who did like him and would have wanted him to continue. However, even I let this go, (too easily in my opinion) but I did. I gave the benefit of the doubt and waited with anticipation for our next chapter. Maybe, just maybe, we were going to keep moving onward and upwards and the decision would be proven right.
Now if we had gotten a Mourinho or an Ancelotti, or a Guardiola or the like then it may have worked. If we had a top manager, and replaced modric and VDV, then Bale may have even stayed. But if he did not, then those managers would have brought in the kind of players we needed to move on without him.
I have been calling for Levy to step down for a while now and I think it will only be this action that will give us the chance to move on in the right direction. He is the central cause of all of our problems and needs to step aside, or seriously step back and let those that know, do.
I agree with Blackjack's analysis of the side. I would also throw into the mix the loss of Parker. Yes, he wasn't a big name, big money signing, but we seriously miss his grit, determination and leadership on the pitch. So I would add a CM to the list of players we need. Yes, it will mean losing one of our current bunch, but to build a team, you need team players.
Personally I believe, like many others, that sacking Harry was a massive mistake, whether some of you like it or not, Spurs as a Club were really starting to go somewhere with Harry and his Coaching team at the Helm, I do not, like some, believe that he had taken us as far as he was capable of, had Levy have given him the funds, we would not be in the position that we now find ourselves, cast your minds back, Harry was never given the money to buy quality players, but the players he did buy were quality players, which he bought at bargain prices (VDV 8 Mil, Parker 5.5 Mil, Crouch 9 Mil, Kranjcar 2 Mil, Bassong 8 Mil, Defoe 15.75 Mil to name 6) everyone of them QUALITY PLAYERS bought for a total of 48 million pounds and I do not recall him complaining about it once, apart from when in Jan 2012 when he had to sign two players on free transfers because Levy wouldn't make available funds for him to strengthen the squad, imagine the type of players he would have signed given 100 million pounds to spend, the mind boggles, and I guarantee you this he would get the players now at Spurs playing as a Team, can you imagine Redknapp and Joe Jordan letting them get away with the 2nd half performance that they served up on Sat, because I can't.
I was always against the appointment of AVB and I was vocal about it, people on here are saying that TS has no experience as a coach but at least he has played at the top level, and has a PL Championship medal to show for it, and more importantly he played for SPURS, AVB NEVER played the game, his experience as a Senior Coach was 1Yr, yes 1 year in Portugal, and 8 mths at Chelsea who fired him, then Levy appoints him at Spurs. What a F-----G JOKE. Quite frankly I do not give a flying F--K that he achieved our highest points tally in the PL last season it got us nothing, nada, zero, in doing it we played some of the most BORING, UNATTRACTIVE and NEGATIVE football I have ever seen SPURS play, and I have been watching Spurs for 60 years.
Whether you like it or not under Redknapp we would be pushing for the Title instead of a Europa Cup place(which at present looks beyond our reach).
>:( >:( >:( >:( >:( >:( :-[ :-[ :-[ :-[ :-[ :( :( :( :( :(
With regards to Redknapp, yes, albeit with hindsight, you are correct. However will we ever be told the truth about what went on during January 2012, with his court case, and the speculation over the England job, and the REAL reason why he was sacked ???
If Levy had any decency, then he owes it to us Spurs fans to be honest and tell us what went wrong then.
But he wont, and he should also be sacked.
But does any top club director tell us what is going on? And even if Levy got the sack would the new man be any more forthcoming? I doubt it. We could sack him and get somebody like the Vincent Tan. Then we would be praying for Levy to come back.
Remember; power and money means arrogance and not kowtowing to the minions; i.e. us. We have our place, paying for the tickets and loyally supporting our club. Beyond that; nothing. Sack Levy and you will get the same.
Surely somebody has to be held to account for the debacle that has occurred ??
You would think. However, the same was said about Stalin, Hitler etc. But it never made a difference :up:
-
Well done Blackjack, glad you decided to start this thread and have put your points across really well too.
Actually everyone for once seems to be saying very similar points with slights variations of course, so well done everyone. I think the reality of what has happened has sunk in to even the hardiest of Harry haters. Not that we need to get into the Harry debate again, but the evidence for what has happened since is clear for everyone to see.
I felt that sacking Harry at the time was completely crazy, regardless of the England situation, where we were as a side was playing the best football I have seen in my lifetime, with a real belief and renewed passion in my club. At last it looked like we were going places. In fact it wasn't really the sacking that bothered me, so much, it was the way it was done that really gave me a foreboding vision of the future. It demonstrated a lack of respect and appreciation for the manager that really put us on the world map. It also disrespected the fans who did like him and would have wanted him to continue. However, even I let this go, (too easily in my opinion) but I did. I gave the benefit of the doubt and waited with anticipation for our next chapter. Maybe, just maybe, we were going to keep moving onward and upwards and the decision would be proven right.
Now if we had gotten a Mourinho or an Ancelotti, or a Guardiola or the like then it may have worked. If we had a top manager, and replaced modric and VDV, then Bale may have even stayed. But if he did not, then those managers would have brought in the kind of players we needed to move on without him.
I have been calling for Levy to step down for a while now and I think it will only be this action that will give us the chance to move on in the right direction. He is the central cause of all of our problems and needs to step aside, or seriously step back and let those that know, do.
I agree with Blackjack's analysis of the side. I would also throw into the mix the loss of Parker. Yes, he wasn't a big name, big money signing, but we seriously miss his grit, determination and leadership on the pitch. So I would add a CM to the list of players we need. Yes, it will mean losing one of our current bunch, but to build a team, you need team players.
Personally I believe, like many others, that sacking Harry was a massive mistake, whether some of you like it or not, Spurs as a Club were really starting to go somewhere with Harry and his Coaching team at the Helm, I do not, like some, believe that he had taken us as far as he was capable of, had Levy have given him the funds, we would not be in the position that we now find ourselves, cast your minds back, Harry was never given the money to buy quality players, but the players he did buy were quality players, which he bought at bargain prices (VDV 8 Mil, Parker 5.5 Mil, Crouch 9 Mil, Kranjcar 2 Mil, Bassong 8 Mil, Defoe 15.75 Mil to name 6) everyone of them QUALITY PLAYERS bought for a total of 48 million pounds and I do not recall him complaining about it once, apart from when in Jan 2012 when he had to sign two players on free transfers because Levy wouldn't make available funds for him to strengthen the squad, imagine the type of players he would have signed given 100 million pounds to spend, the mind boggles, and I guarantee you this he would get the players now at Spurs playing as a Team, can you imagine Redknapp and Joe Jordan letting them get away with the 2nd half performance that they served up on Sat, because I can't.
I was always against the appointment of AVB and I was vocal about it, people on here are saying that TS has no experience as a coach but at least he has played at the top level, and has a PL Championship medal to show for it, and more importantly he played for SPURS, AVB NEVER played the game, his experience as a Senior Coach was 1Yr, yes 1 year in Portugal, and 8 mths at Chelsea who fired him, then Levy appoints him at Spurs. What a F-----G JOKE. Quite frankly I do not give a flying F--K that he achieved our highest points tally in the PL last season it got us nothing, nada, zero, in doing it we played some of the most BORING, UNATTRACTIVE and NEGATIVE football I have ever seen SPURS play, and I have been watching Spurs for 60 years.
Whether you like it or not under Redknapp we would be pushing for the Title instead of a Europa Cup place(which at present looks beyond our reach).
>:( >:( >:( >:( >:( >:( :-[ :-[ :-[ :-[ :-[ :( :( :( :( :(
With regards to Redknapp, yes, albeit with hindsight, you are correct. However will we ever be told the truth about what went on during January 2012, with his court case, and the speculation over the England job, and the REAL reason why he was sacked ???
If Levy had any decency, then he owes it to us Spurs fans to be honest and tell us what went wrong then.
But he wont, and he should also be sacked.
But does any top club director tell us what is going on? And even if Levy got the sack would the new man be any more forthcoming? I doubt it. We could sack him and get somebody like the Vincent Tan. Then we would be praying for Levy to come back.
Remember; power and money means arrogance and not kowtowing to the minions; i.e. us. We have our place, paying for the tickets and loyally supporting our club. Beyond that; nothing. Sack Levy and you will get the same.
Surely somebody has to be held to account for the debacle that has occurred ??
You would think. However, the same was said about Stalin, Hitler etc. But it never made a difference :up:
WTF no comparison to what is going on at our club FFS!
We know who will be held accountable and he has set himself up nicely, TS but to be honest he isnt the man for us at this stage so no great loss, to be honest I would go as far as to say we are in turmoil as a club both on and off the pitch!
-
Well done Blackjack, glad you decided to start this thread and have put your points across really well too.
Actually everyone for once seems to be saying very similar points with slights variations of course, so well done everyone. I think the reality of what has happened has sunk in to even the hardiest of Harry haters. Not that we need to get into the Harry debate again, but the evidence for what has happened since is clear for everyone to see.
I felt that sacking Harry at the time was completely crazy, regardless of the England situation, where we were as a side was playing the best football I have seen in my lifetime, with a real belief and renewed passion in my club. At last it looked like we were going places. In fact it wasn't really the sacking that bothered me, so much, it was the way it was done that really gave me a foreboding vision of the future. It demonstrated a lack of respect and appreciation for the manager that really put us on the world map. It also disrespected the fans who did like him and would have wanted him to continue. However, even I let this go, (too easily in my opinion) but I did. I gave the benefit of the doubt and waited with anticipation for our next chapter. Maybe, just maybe, we were going to keep moving onward and upwards and the decision would be proven right.
Now if we had gotten a Mourinho or an Ancelotti, or a Guardiola or the like then it may have worked. If we had a top manager, and replaced modric and VDV, then Bale may have even stayed. But if he did not, then those managers would have brought in the kind of players we needed to move on without him.
I have been calling for Levy to step down for a while now and I think it will only be this action that will give us the chance to move on in the right direction. He is the central cause of all of our problems and needs to step aside, or seriously step back and let those that know, do.
I agree with Blackjack's analysis of the side. I would also throw into the mix the loss of Parker. Yes, he wasn't a big name, big money signing, but we seriously miss his grit, determination and leadership on the pitch. So I would add a CM to the list of players we need. Yes, it will mean losing one of our current bunch, but to build a team, you need team players.
Personally I believe, like many others, that sacking Harry was a massive mistake, whether some of you like it or not, Spurs as a Club were really starting to go somewhere with Harry and his Coaching team at the Helm, I do not, like some, believe that he had taken us as far as he was capable of, had Levy have given him the funds, we would not be in the position that we now find ourselves, cast your minds back, Harry was never given the money to buy quality players, but the players he did buy were quality players, which he bought at bargain prices (VDV 8 Mil, Parker 5.5 Mil, Crouch 9 Mil, Kranjcar 2 Mil, Bassong 8 Mil, Defoe 15.75 Mil to name 6) everyone of them QUALITY PLAYERS bought for a total of 48 million pounds and I do not recall him complaining about it once, apart from when in Jan 2012 when he had to sign two players on free transfers because Levy wouldn't make available funds for him to strengthen the squad, imagine the type of players he would have signed given 100 million pounds to spend, the mind boggles, and I guarantee you this he would get the players now at Spurs playing as a Team, can you imagine Redknapp and Joe Jordan letting them get away with the 2nd half performance that they served up on Sat, because I can't.
I was always against the appointment of AVB and I was vocal about it, people on here are saying that TS has no experience as a coach but at least he has played at the top level, and has a PL Championship medal to show for it, and more importantly he played for SPURS, AVB NEVER played the game, his experience as a Senior Coach was 1Yr, yes 1 year in Portugal, and 8 mths at Chelsea who fired him, then Levy appoints him at Spurs. What a F-----G JOKE. Quite frankly I do not give a flying F--K that he achieved our highest points tally in the PL last season it got us nothing, nada, zero, in doing it we played some of the most BORING, UNATTRACTIVE and NEGATIVE football I have ever seen SPURS play, and I have been watching Spurs for 60 years.
Whether you like it or not under Redknapp we would be pushing for the Title instead of a Europa Cup place(which at present looks beyond our reach).
>:( >:( >:( >:( >:( >:( :-[ :-[ :-[ :-[ :-[ :( :( :( :( :(
With regards to Redknapp, yes, albeit with hindsight, you are correct. However will we ever be told the truth about what went on during January 2012, with his court case, and the speculation over the England job, and the REAL reason why he was sacked ???
If Levy had any decency, then he owes it to us Spurs fans to be honest and tell us what went wrong then.
But he wont, and he should also be sacked.
But does any top club director tell us what is going on? And even if Levy got the sack would the new man be any more forthcoming? I doubt it. We could sack him and get somebody like the Vincent Tan. Then we would be praying for Levy to come back.
Remember; power and money means arrogance and not kowtowing to the minions; i.e. us. We have our place, paying for the tickets and loyally supporting our club. Beyond that; nothing. Sack Levy and you will get the same.
Surely somebody has to be held to account for the debacle that has occurred ??
You would think. However, the same was said about Stalin, Hitler etc. But it never made a difference :up:
WTF no comparison to what is going on at our club FFS!
We know who will be held accountable and he has set himself up nicely, TS but to be honest he isnt the man for us at this stage so no great loss, to be honest I would go as far as to say we are in turmoil as a club both on and off the pitch!
Of course there is no comparison; it was said tongue-in-cheek. However, I do agree that we are in a turmoil. So much hopes at the beginning of the season and now.........!
-
Thats the shocker when the season started we were on a high with all the new signing and their hoped for impact, we started well with best defensive record in the top flight leagues in Europe, results were being ground out but many of us had concerns as to how we were playing but this was attributed to a settling down period or so we hoped.
Now we are in a mire, a manager who is all but gone just playing out the season and most players who couldnt give a toss about our club and are no doubt concentrating on who their agents are lining up for them to play for next season!
TBH Europa cup would be a sweetner and I have now changed my view that the more game time our players get to together the better, top 4 is over so lets switch priorities to see if we can win the Europa this season and give us battered supporters something to smile about at least for a few minutes!
-
Quote from Voice,
"Of course there is no comparison; it was said tongue-in-cheek. However, I do agree that we are in a turmoil. So much hopes at the beginning of the season and now.........!"
I am glad you find the predicament that Spurs find themselves in comical Voice, maybe, because in your mind this somehow makes you right regarding the sacking of your hero AVB (who should, imo and many others who contribute to this forum, never have been appointed in the first place), there-in lies the problem, for someone who purports to be a passionate supporter, your comments are somewhat distasteful, and I am sure that I am not the only one who thinks this.!!!! >:( >:( >:( >:(
-
Metal,
Pray tell me how this is Sherwood's fault, unfortunately he had no way of controlling the pathetic attitude of the players, after we conceded the dubious penalty and resultant sending off of Kaboul, I was a little surprised at the team selected, but at half-time I thought that the team looked too really be in the game, and then, well, we all know what happened. Yes he is inexperienced, and has made some mistakes but haven't we all at sometime made mistakes, I know I have, the secret is too learn from them, just give the guy a chance, to change the coach again would, imo, be pretty bloody STUPID, and a further step backwards.
We are all pissed off at they way the season has panned out, but as I said "Give TS a chance".
:nods: :nods: :nods:
-
Thats the shocker when the season started we were on a high with all the new signing and their hoped for impact, we started well with best defensive record in the top flight leagues in Europe, results were being ground out but many of us had concerns as to how we were playing but this was attributed to a settling down period or so we hoped.
Now we are in a mire, a manager who is all but gone just playing out the season and most players who couldnt give a toss about our club and are no doubt concentrating on who their agents are lining up for them to play for next season!
TBH Europa cup would be a sweetner and I have now changed my view that the more game time our players get to together the better, top 4 is over so lets switch priorities to see if we can win the Europa this season and give us battered supporters something to smile about at least for a few minutes!
Unfortunately Metal, I think that our chances of winning the EL are about as good as finishing top 4.
I dont even think we will get past Benfica, though I hope I'm wrong
-
Quote from Voice,
"Of course there is no comparison; it was said tongue-in-cheek. However, I do agree that we are in a turmoil. So much hopes at the beginning of the season and now.........!"
I am glad you find the predicament that Spurs find themselves in comical Voice, maybe, because in your mind this somehow makes you right regarding the sacking of your hero AVB (who should, imo and many others who contribute to this forum, never have been appointed in the first place), there-in lies the problem, for someone who purports to be a passionate supporter, your comments are somewhat distasteful, and I am sure that I am not the only one who thinks this.!!!! >:( >:( >:( >:(
I didn't say it was (our position) "comical" nor do I think it is. I just said the comment I made was tongue in cheek.
My comments are only "distasteful" because you don't like me. Nothing to do with what I've said.
-
Metal,
Pray tell me how this is Sherwood's fault, unfortunately he had no way of controlling the pathetic attitude of the players, after we conceded the dubious penalty and resultant sending off of Kaboul, I was a little surprised at the team selected, but at half-time I thought that the team looked too really be in the game, and then, well, we all know what happened. Yes he is inexperienced, and has made some mistakes but haven't we all at sometime made mistakes, I know I have, the secret is too learn from them, just give the guy a chance, to change the coach again would, imo, be pretty bloody STUPID, and a further step backwards.
We are all pissed off at they way the season has panned out, but as I said "Give TS a chance".
:nods: :nods: :nods:
Paul F,
I havent said this whole mess is the fault of TS, TBH he is not the man for Spurs for where we want to be and what currently needs to be done plain and simple, he clearly is not the man capable of managing and motivating the players we have at the moment let along bigger characters.
As I have stated previously the common factor in all of our downward spirals is Levy that is where fault lies. TS is in a short term role as Levy intended for the remainder of the season and will take the fall for our failings.
I actually believe with 10 years or so under his belt TS will be a cracking manager, he has passion and pride very straight talking and wears his heart on his sleeve but he also has a lot to learn regarding management and THFC is not the place for him to learn IMO for so many reasons.
He will be replaced at the end of the season I am certain but not before, if not at the end of the end of the season then maybe Levy will back him and make the required signings TS wants but I cant see him staying or Levy backing him and TBH if he does stay we are in for an even worse season 14-15 i fear.
-
Metal,
Pray tell me how this is Sherwood's fault, unfortunately he had no way of controlling the pathetic attitude of the players, after we conceded the dubious penalty and resultant sending off of Kaboul, I was a little surprised at the team selected, but at half-time I thought that the team looked too really be in the game, and then, well, we all know what happened. Yes he is inexperienced, and has made some mistakes but haven't we all at sometime made mistakes, I know I have, the secret is too learn from them, just give the guy a chance, to change the coach again would, imo, be pretty bloody STUPID, and a further step backwards.
We are all pissed off at they way the season has panned out, but as I said "Give TS a chance".
:nods: :nods: :nods:
Paul F,
I havent said this whole mess is the fault of TS, TBH he is not the man for Spurs for where we want to be and what currently needs to be done plain and simple, he clearly is not the man capable of managing and motivating the players we have at the moment let along bigger characters.
As I have stated previously the common factor in all of our downward spirals is Levy that is where fault lies. TS is in a short term role as Levy intended for the remainder of the season and will take the fall for our failings.
I actually believe with 10 years or so under his belt TS will be a cracking manager, he has passion and pride very straight talking and wears his heart on his sleeve but he also has a lot to learn regarding management and THFC is not the place for him to learn IMO for so many reasons.
He will be replaced at the end of the season I am certain but not before, if not at the end of the end of the season then maybe Levy will back him and make the required signings TS wants but I cant see him staying or Levy backing him and TBH if he does stay we are in for an even worse season 14-15 i fear.
According to reports coming out of Spurs they still have faith in Sherwood and he will be still here next season. Some official from Spurs reminded us that Sherwood's contract is for next season as well. But that doesn't really mean anything.
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Quote from Voice,
"My comments are only "distasteful" because you don't like me. Nothing to do with what I've said."
Yes Voice you are quite correct I do not like you, I find you to be not only an arrogant and ignorant little man, but also someone who thinks he knows-it-all, but in fact knows the same as the rest of us, I have never suffered fools gladly and I am far too long in the tooth to start doing so now.
:nods: :nods: :nods: :nods: :nods:
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Hey chaps keep calm and prosper :up: , this is a Spurs forum not a world war slagging off match!, this is exactly why Biggs left!, we are all intitled to our opininion but we should think very carefully before we type!, I know you want to get your points across but doing so by pointing the finger at inderviduals on this forum is only provoking a reaction back and so soon becomes nothing to do with the subject in question! but personal attack after personal attack!, so please lets keep this about the one thing we all love Tottenham Hotspur football club. :) :up: .
P.S my name in a previous life was Wyatt Earp!!! :D :D :grin: :grin: :dance: :dance: :dance: :2funny: :2funny: :2funny: :2funny:
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Hey chaps keep calm and prosper :up: , this is a Spurs forum not a world war slagging off match!, this is exactly why Biggs left!, we are all intitled to our opininion but we should think very carefully before we type!, I know you want to get your points across but doing so by pointing the finger at inderviduals on this forum is only provoking a reaction back and so soon becomes nothing to do with the subject in question! but personal attack after personal attack!, so please lets keep this about the one thing we all love Tottenham Hotspur football club. :) :up: .
P.S my name in a previous life was Wyatt Earp!!! :D :D :grin: :grin: :dance: :dance: :dance: :2funny: :2funny: :2funny: :2funny:
And it totally kills the thread! and this one to be fair is bloody good, or was !
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Well done Blackjack, glad you decided to start this thread and have put your points across really well too.
Actually everyone for once seems to be saying very similar points with slights variations of course, so well done everyone. I think the reality of what has happened has sunk in to even the hardiest of Harry haters. Not that we need to get into the Harry debate again, but the evidence for what has happened since is clear for everyone to see.
I felt that sacking Harry at the time was completely crazy, regardless of the England situation, where we were as a side was playing the best football I have seen in my lifetime, with a real belief and renewed passion in my club. At last it looked like we were going places. In fact it wasn't really the sacking that bothered me, so much, it was the way it was done that really gave me a foreboding vision of the future. It demonstrated a lack of respect and appreciation for the manager that really put us on the world map. It also disrespected the fans who did like him and would have wanted him to continue. However, even I let this go, (too easily in my opinion) but I did. I gave the benefit of the doubt and waited with anticipation for our next chapter. Maybe, just maybe, we were going to keep moving onward and upwards and the decision would be proven right.
Now if we had gotten a Mourinho or an Ancelotti, or a Guardiola or the like then it may have worked. If we had a top manager, and replaced modric and VDV, then Bale may have even stayed. But if he did not, then those managers would have brought in the kind of players we needed to move on without him.
I have been calling for Levy to step down for a while now and I think it will only be this action that will give us the chance to move on in the right direction. He is the central cause of all of our problems and needs to step aside, or seriously step back and let those that know, do.
I agree with Blackjack's analysis of the side. I would also throw into the mix the loss of Parker. Yes, he wasn't a big name, big money signing, but we seriously miss his grit, determination and leadership on the pitch. So I would add a CM to the list of players we need. Yes, it will mean losing one of our current bunch, but to build a team, you need team players.
Personally I believe, like many others, that sacking Harry was a massive mistake, whether some of you like it or not, Spurs as a Club were really starting to go somewhere with Harry and his Coaching team at the Helm, I do not, like some, believe that he had taken us as far as he was capable of, had Levy have given him the funds, we would not be in the position that we now find ourselves, cast your minds back, Harry was never given the money to buy quality players, but the players he did buy were quality players, which he bought at bargain prices (VDV 8 Mil, Parker 5.5 Mil, Crouch 9 Mil, Kranjcar 2 Mil, Bassong 8 Mil, Defoe 15.75 Mil to name 6) everyone of them QUALITY PLAYERS bought for a total of 48 million pounds and I do not recall him complaining about it once, apart from when in Jan 2012 when he had to sign two players on free transfers because Levy wouldn't make available funds for him to strengthen the squad, imagine the type of players he would have signed given 100 million pounds to spend, the mind boggles, and I guarantee you this he would get the players now at Spurs playing as a Team, can you imagine Redknapp and Joe Jordan letting them get away with the 2nd half performance that they served up on Sat, because I can't.
I was always against the appointment of AVB and I was vocal about it, people on here are saying that TS has no experience as a coach but at least he has played at the top level, and has a PL Championship medal to show for it, and more importantly he played for SPURS, AVB NEVER played the game, his experience as a Senior Coach was 1Yr, yes 1 year in Portugal, and 8 mths at Chelsea who fired him, then Levy appoints him at Spurs. What a F-----G JOKE. Quite frankly I do not give a flying F--K that he achieved our highest points tally in the PL last season it got us nothing, nada, zero, in doing it we played some of the most BORING, UNATTRACTIVE and NEGATIVE football I have ever seen SPURS play, and I have been watching Spurs for 60 years.
Whether you like it or not under Redknapp we would be pushing for the Title instead of a Europa Cup place(which at present looks beyond our reach).
>:( >:( >:( >:( >:( >:( :-[ :-[ :-[ :-[ :-[ :( :( :( :( :(
With regards to Redknapp, yes, albeit with hindsight, you are correct. However will we ever be told the truth about what went on during January 2012, with his court case, and the speculation over the England job, and the REAL reason why he was sacked ???
If Levy had any decency, then he owes it to us Spurs fans to be honest and tell us what went wrong then.
But he wont, and he should also be sacked.
But does any top club director tell us what is going on? And even if Levy got the sack would the new man be any more forthcoming? I doubt it. We could sack him and get somebody like the Vincent Tan. Then we would be praying for Levy to come back.
Remember; power and money means arrogance and not kowtowing to the minions; i.e. us. We have our place, paying for the tickets and loyally supporting our club. Beyond that; nothing. Sack Levy and you will get the same.
Surely somebody has to be held to account for the debacle that has occurred ??
You would think. However, the same was said about Stalin, Hitler etc. But it never made a difference :up:
Actually, it did. Hitler committed suicide !!
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I was reading that Sherwood has warned his players that if they don't improve soon they might find themselves out next season. Let us hope this season is a blip and things improve next season. But to be fair we've been saying that every season.
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I was reading that Sherwood has warned his players that if they don't improve soon they might find themselves out next season. Let us hope this season is a blip and things improve next season. But to be fair we've been saying that every season.
Well I'd like to see the list !!
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I was reading that Sherwood has warned his players that if they don't improve soon they might find themselves out next season. Let us hope this season is a blip and things improve next season. But to be fair we've been saying that every season.
Not the way to do it, I mean these players that are lacking motivation and under performing probably wouldnt care if they were out next season, lets face it we wont exactly be releasing them to be free agents!
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I was reading that Sherwood has warned his players that if they don't improve soon they might find themselves out next season. Let us hope this season is a blip and things improve next season. But to be fair we've been saying that every season.
Not the way to do it, I mean these players that are lacking motivation and under performing probably wouldnt care if they were out next season, lets face it we wont exactly be releasing them to be free agents!
Sherwood has already criticised for making it public.
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I was reading that Sherwood has warned his players that if they don't improve soon they might find themselves out next season. Let us hope this season is a blip and things improve next season. But to be fair we've been saying that every season.
Not the way to do it, I mean these players that are lacking motivation and under performing probably wouldnt care if they were out next season, lets face it we wont exactly be releasing them to be free agents!
Sherwood has already criticised for making it public.
Whilst in normal circumstances a manager should not say things like that ( ie the truth ) in public, I think in just this one case, he is fully justified. Something drastic needed to be done to wake our lot up after Chelsea. Whether it has the desired effect remains to be seen, tonight and on Sunday.
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Sherwood has come out and said that Spurs players are playing for there futures!, thats great it needed to be said,...BUT I feel some of them are not bothered, they are just waiting for something better to come along then jump ship!.
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Sherwood has come out and said that Spurs players are playing for there futures!, thats great it needed to be said,...BUT I feel some of them are not bothered, they are just waiting for something better to come along then jump ship!.
Well I will help push them. If we are to get anywhere then those kind of players need to be got shot of, and by the sound of it Tim might be the one to do just that.
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I was reading that Sherwood has warned his players that if they don't improve soon they might find themselves out next season. Let us hope this season is a blip and things improve next season. But to be fair we've been saying that every season.
Not the way to do it, I mean these players that are lacking motivation and under performing probably wouldnt care if they were out next season, lets face it we wont exactly be releasing them to be free agents!
Sherwood has already criticised for making it public.
Whilst in normal circumstances a manager should not say things like that ( ie the truth ) in public, I think in just this one case, he is fully justified. Something drastic needed to be done to wake our lot up after Chelsea. Whether it has the desired effect remains to be seen, tonight and on Sunday.
Sadly I've got to agree with you. I was watching some Spurs matches (on DVD) with Modric and Bale) and they played brilliantly compared to what we've got now. There is no heart in it.
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Lets face it, look at our midfield! Erriksen creative attacking player great, Dembelle hard holding midfield player but not up to scratch going forward and no pace!, Sandro holding midfield player!, Lennon attacking winger THAT NEVER PLAYS DOWN THE WING JUST WONDERS INFIELD!!!, far to small gets knocked off the ball to easy!, Chadli, winger, not seen enough of him yet but still lacks enough pace for a really good winger!, Lamela..WHO? nowhere near as good as made out to be, shocking ball control!, Capouee ANOTHER HOLDING MIDFIELD PLAYER!!!, doubles up as a defender so that has some posetives!.
Siggursen attacking midfield player who is about average but lacks pace!, see the pattern emerging already ,...NO PACE IN OUR TEAM! NO REAL GOAL THREAT FROM MIDFIELD!!!!.theres no wonder we struggle this selection is not balanced to ever work, its not set up to play to there strengths, . we are nowhere near good enough.
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Lets face it, look at our midfield! Erriksen creative attacking player great, Dembelle hard holding midfield player but not up to scratch going forward and no pace!, Sandro holding midfield player!, Lennon attacking winger THAT NEVER PLAYS DOWN THE WING JUST WONDERS INFIELD!!!, far to small gets knocked off the ball to easy!, Chadli, winger, not seen enough of him yet but still lacks enough pace for a really good winger!, Lamela..WHO? nowhere near as good as made out to be, shocking ball control!, Capouee ANOTHER HOLDING MIDFIELD PLAYER!!!, doubles up as a defender so that has some posetives!.
Siggursen attacking midfield player who is about average but lacks pace!, see the pattern emerging already ,...NO PACE IN OUR TEAM! NO REAL GOAL THREAT FROM MIDFIELD!!!!.theres no wonder we struggle this selection is not balanced to ever work, its not set up to play to there strengths, . we are nowhere near good enough.
Agreed Blackjack. Eriksen might just turn out to be the new Teddy Sheringham. As for the rest of them, Sandro excepted, they are just not good enough or quick enough. It pains me to say it, but even Ars*nals second string players have more pace, passing ability and holding ability than us. Good luck Sunday, we are gonna need it.
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Shall I start the Pray thread? together we might get enough bodies for the man upstairs to give us some devine inspiration :D :D :D :2funny: :dance: :dance: :dance: .
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The Man Upstairs is Sherwood at the moment. He is the one who should be giving us the divine inspiration we badly need.
I wonder if his rant last Saturday will have any effect on the players tonight!
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The Man Upstairs is Sherwood at the moment. He is the one who should be giving us the divine inspiration we badly need.
I wonder if his rant last Saturday will have any effect on the players tonight!
I would be very very surprised if it has any effect, most dont care and are no doubt looking to their next move!
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The Man Upstairs is Sherwood at the moment. He is the one who should be giving us the divine inspiration we badly need.
I wonder if his rant last Saturday will have any effect on the players tonight!
I would be very very surprised if it has any effect, most dont care and are no doubt looking to their next move!
Sad but probably true. Wait until we play the Arse on Sunday. The Gooners must be having a ball!
No pun intended
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I think we will get well and truely put to the sword Sunday! I almost dont want to watch it! and Sherwood will resign after this game Im sure of it! he knows with the crop of shyte out there now there nothing he can do!, they just never learn! tonights game was no different, we seem to start of brightly then fade as the game goes on!, watching Kaboul with his hands in the air several times asking the players to find some space for him to pass it to?, Nothing, were so static, so cramped, and dreadfull going forward now, no idea what to do from our defence out!, the team is a shambles at present, can not believe how much worse we have got!. when Benfica scored the first goal, not one player showed an ounce of emotion!, they all had there heads down!!!, it is heart breaking to watch this team play now, if thats what I should call it!, we dont really look like a team who could win any football match now!. where o where has our passion and desire to win gone?. :'( :'( :'( :'(
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Our season is fully over, now its really damage limitation for the league.
As our performances we seem to be on a rapid decline game by game, I am not at all hopeful of us even finishing in a Europa league spot as things stand.
If that happens it could be a blessing or a major issue, a blessing so we have few games next season so we can put all our limited resources into the league, but I fear more so a major issue as its shows our rapid decline and may mean key players want out and we will struggle to attract new quality.
Oh what it is to be a Spurs supporter!
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Our season is fully over, now its really damage limitation for the league.
As our performances we seem to be on a rapid decline game by game, I am not at all hopeful of us even finishing in a Europa league spot as things stand.
If that happens it could be a blessing or a major issue, a blessing so we have few games next season so we can put all our limited resources into the league, but I fear more so a major issue as its shows our rapid decline and may mean key players want out and we will struggle to attract new quality.
Oh what it is to be a Spurs supporter!
Metal pretty much sums up our predicament. TS finally showed last night that he has absolutely no chance as manager of our club. He has tried every single player, combination of players, systems, coaxing their ego's, slagging them off, squaring up to Benfica's manager. After we get smashed by Ars*nal on Sunday he will probably lamp Levy and go.
Seriously though, in answer to the original thread, yes we are in Terminal decline with this lot, and going in totally the wrong direction.
A total re-think and evaluation of our huge mistakes over the last 2 years is needed.
Starting with Van Gaal.
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This is a doom & gloom thread at his best. I haven't seen one of those since the fellow with the Jack Russell!
Having said that, you are too far from the truth and we have to be prepared to face even more damage starting with our game on Sunday. (or NOT?)
As far as Sherwood is concerned, this is getting to him in a big way and it will no doubt get worse if these scorelines are maintained.
Obviously the season is not over yet, but when (not if) ManU overtakes us, then it will be over for sure!
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Somebody on here said that our season is over now; I am afraid it was over long before the Benfica game. We should now be planning on next season.
I was at the game yesterday and I was talking to somebody who has been going since the 40s and I said to him; we won't make the top 4 and he replied "We'll be bloody lucky if we make the top 7". We can't right off either Everton or United. Both have games in hand and we've got Ars*nal this weekend.
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Somebody on here said that our season is over now; I am afraid it was over long before the Benfica game. We should now be planning on next season.
I was at the game yesterday and I was talking to somebody who has been going since the 40s and I said to him; we won't make the top 4 and he replied "We'll be bloody lucky if we make the top 7". We can't right off either Everton or United. Both have games in hand and we've got Ars*nal this weekend.
Our chances of achieving what we set out to do this season is over!
Unless of course the target was to regress by 10 years and f**k everything up then its mission accomplished!
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Harry Redknapp is and was a 'now' manager, he wants proven experienced players who will do a job for him now, youth is a distinct second choice. That however leaves an old squad that need overhauling wherever he goes.
There is nothing wrong with that approach but it does nothing for a clubs future. It served us at the time to do a job, it got us to playing in the Champions League, a feat no other manager has achieved.
Daniel Levy needed a manager who would reduce the age of a team and build the clubs future in the manner Ars*nal have done. With an ageing side you constantly have to re-invent it and that is not a recipe for ongoing success.
First that was Andre Villas-Boas and when he took us backwards, Tim Sherwood took over on what is a temporary appointment in all but name.
We hurt just as Liverpool hurt last season but to take the club forward and build something it was the right decision.
Unfortunately AVB was not the right choice, we all thought he was and we were wrong as well so to criticise an appointment we were virtually all in favour of is only doing so with hindsight.
Bale stayed an extra season and we didn't get Champions League he then simply refused to wear a Spurs shirt again to force his move so Levy had no option but to sell, Modric refused to play and we kept him for an extra season and failed to get Champions League and Van Der Vaart went to Germany to try and save his marriage so you can hardly blame him for that, or stand in his way,
Harry wasn't given £100 million because we didn't have £100 million, we hadn't sold Bale by then. He has never had a youthful side, it's always old men. He never builds for the future, no club has had a future he's left, they have all had to rebuild.
However I do like your assessment of this season. sounds very accurate. Tim has always been an interim manager, albeit the wrong one, and the players clearly know it so aren't bothered, except for a few. It a question of wait for Van Gaal or Prandelli in the summer and endure more pain for the rest of this season.
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Somebody on here said that our season is over now; I am afraid it was over long before the Benfica game. We should now be planning on next season.
I was at the game yesterday and I was talking to somebody who has been going since the 40s and I said to him; we won't make the top 4 and he replied "We'll be bloody lucky if we make the top 7". We can't right off either Everton or United. Both have games in hand and we've got Ars*nal this weekend.
Our chances of achieving what we set out to do this season is over!
Unless of course the target was to regress by 10 years and f**k everything up then its mission accomplished!
I think it was over when they sacked AVB. Whether you think Sherwood is a good manager or not he, like AVB, would need years to build a team to challenge for top honours.
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Will any manager be afforded the required time to build and bond a team, whilst Levy is about I dont think so!
Quick fix, right results and lots of yes Mr Levy , no Mr Levy and few requests for transfer funds or its bye bye, next!
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Harry Redknapp is and was a 'now' manager, he wants proven experienced players who will do a job for him now, youth is a distinct second choice. That however leaves an old squad that need overhauling wherever he goes.
There is nothing wrong with that approach but it does nothing for a clubs future. It served us at the time to do a job, it g
ot us to playing in the Champions League, a feat no other manager has achieved.
Daniel Levy needed a manager who would reduce the age of a team and build the clubs future in the manner Ars*nal have done. With an ageing side you constantly have to re-invent it and that is not a recipe for ongoing success.
First that was Andre Villas-Boas and when he took us backwards, Tim Sherwood took over on what is a temporary appointment in all but name.
We hurt just as Liverpool hurt last season but to take the club forward and build something it was the right decision.
Unfortunately AVB was not the right choice, we all thought he was and we were wrong as well so to criticise an appointment we were virtually all in favour of is only doing so with hindsight.
Bale stayed an extra season and we didn't get Champions League he then simply refused to wear a Spurs shirt again to force his move so Levy had no option but to sell, Modric refused to play and we kept him for an extra season and failed to get Champions League and Van Der Vaart went to Germany to try and save his marriage so you can hardly blame him for that, or stand in his way,
Harry wasn't given £100 million because we didn't have £100 million, we hadn't sold Bale by then. He has never had a youthful side, it's always old men. He never builds for the future, no club has had a future he's left, they have all had to rebuild.
However I do like your assessment of this season. sounds very accurate. Tim has always been an interim manager, albeit the wrong one, and the players clearly know it so aren't bothered, except for a few. It a question of wait for Van Gaal or Prandelli in the summer and endure more pain for the rest of this season.
I'm afraid I dissagree with a lot of this, you need to have experience in the team to bring the youth players on, they take them under thete wing, share what they have
Learned and help with the mental state and behavior. You cannot disemble any team , throw in so many new players and expect perfection!, Ars*nal have been grooming a young team but they have been doing it over 10 years, no manager is going to be able to get a full young team. Harry was the right man or at least the best we could hope for, he had us going in the right direction, he would never have bought so many players and put them straight into the team! . Plus the players he brought in where proven quality and they produced it!, that was no fluke that was down to years of experience, his team had a good understanding and the got players in where they where needed!. Look at us now, directors of football , chairmens who want a team made up by them, but what they fail to realise is the players the want play a certain way and have played for a team that's the finished article!, spurs are now a jigsaw , pieces here pieces there which are just being thrown together to see if they fit. How on earth is any manager going to turn this around?. I was behind Sherwood but we need an Alex fergusson here, a miracle, a manager that gets the players head straight, gets them to play in the position they where bought to play in, get a team formation and stick to it, get a first 11 and keep to it, no more tinkering ever game, play the best players every week to get the confidence up so there quality comes out on the pitch, and most of all go back to basics , go through every players job , the doos and the donts, no more blind passes, no more passing the ball at short distances 90 mph! Look up before you pass to see where your team mate is, no more standing still, no more bunching up, pass and move pass and move, no more taking an extra touch!, no more turning your back to goal, no more taking a man on in your own half, no more passing the ball to a player surrounded by the opposition were no Barcelona!, no more realying on the keeper to boot it up field because we have nowhere to go! Teach the players to cross a football, teach them how to propelly controll a football , and most of all to use there head, if it dosent look right don't do it.
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Having a team full of old players is not the same as having some youth and some experienced players. Harry plays with mainly old men not the mixture you are trying to suggest. Turning down Suarez because he wasn't sure sums his management up completely and I was one happy under Harry. But I understand why he went, he should have been in jail afterall.
Nobody has asked for perfection, but if you are suggesting a season is not long enough to gel then I'm afraid that is just an excuse. Poor tactics are the reason we have been poor. We bought a striker and then didn't pass to him which is utter crazyness. Inverted wingers so we had no width and didn't therefore have any holes to play balls through the defence. All we did was pass the ball about in front of the opposition. That was not down to experience, it was not down to the players, it was down to inept tactics.
A manager will turn it sound because the players will play for a manager when we appoint one. We don't have one, we have an interim manager, he has always been an interim manager and players are not interested in playing for an interim manager who has never managed. We are seeing the result of that. Sherwood should never have been appointed in the first place but he will have to take everything on the chin and muddle through.
Harry Kane or Eriksen as number 10, hang on let me think about that tough choice!
We will have a manager when Louis Van Gaal is appointed but playing the same 11 each week will mean a pissed off squad you can't rely on. Football has changed, it is no longer an 11 man game. Society has changed, everybody wants everything now, football is just mirroring society.
As a manager you have to show progress, if you show progress you get more time, it's quite simple. Don't show progress and you are out. It's the same at every club, Spurs are no different. If you have taken a side backwards in 18 months then you are not up to the task.
What is happening at the moment is pretty irrelevant, half the players are just going through the motions and there is absolutely nothing that can be done about that.
We will see a team again next season.
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Harry Redknapp is and was a 'now' manager, he wants proven experienced players who will do a job for him now, youth is a distinct second choice. That however leaves an old squad that need overhauling wherever he goes.
This is one of the best arguments for Harry I have come across. You are absolutely correct, Harry was a 'now' manager. Do you know why that is the best kind to have? Because now is all there is. If you want to win things you need a side that can play on that day, not next year or the one after that. Of course it does not mean you do not have young players, it just means you buy the right young player, who can play, guess what? now! While he is still manager, your team will be the best it can be, simple. In Fact I would say Alex Fergusson was a now manager too, probably the best one there has ever been. Did he player Beckham, scholes and giggs because they would be good in a few years? No.
I disagree that he only bought old players, as I think he bought players he could trust to do the job, that were also at a price Daniel short arms deep pockets Levy was willing to give him. Yes, there were players who needed to be replaced, the side needed an injection of youth. But for Levy that means buying an unproven younster, who may become the next Bale money machine. Whereas a manager like Redknapp would want a player who could already play at the standard required, and if you want to compete that means spending real money.
You stated that nearly everyone thought AVB was the right appointment at the time. I think you are way off base here. I think lots of people thought it was wrong from the start, then there was the majority, who were apprehensive, but got behind him, because they thought it was worth giving him a chance and then there was a minority who backed fully and believed in him completely. (by the way, are you actually writing under a pseudonym Voice?)
;)
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I think it was over when they sacked AVB. Whether you think Sherwood is a good manager or not he, like AVB, would need years to build a team to challenge for top honours.
Really Vopice, do you really think that was the moment our season was over. The sacking of AVB? Come on we were spiraling out of control. Granted AVB started off okay, but I think that was largely due to the quality of the squad and belief they had from Harry. He clearly was unable to keep that going and was found lacking in so many areas.
Spurs should not have needed years to challenge for the top honours, because the side he inherited was already on the cusp of that ability. The fact that we failed to keep progressing is not solely down to AVB but from where we were to where we are now, is a rapid decline of gargantuan proportions. I blame Levy 75% AVB 15% Us fans for not making more of an issue of this 10%
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I think it was over when they sacked AVB. Whether you think Sherwood is a good manager or not he, like AVB, would need years to build a team to challenge for top honours.
Really Vopice, do you really think that was the moment our season was over. The sacking of AVB? Come on we were spiraling out of control. Granted AVB started off okay, but I think that was largely due to the quality of the squad and belief they had from Harry. He clearly was unable to keep that going and was found lacking in so many areas.
Spurs should not have needed years to challenge for the top honours, because the side he inherited was already on the cusp of that ability. The fact that we failed to keep progressing is not solely down to AVB but from where we were to where we are now, is a rapid decline of gargantuan proportions. I blame Levy 75% AVB 15% Us fans for not making more of an issue of this 10%
Yes, you are right; we inherited and then sold. If we had built on what we had then we might be talking about a lot higher than 4th.
As for AVB; who knows? All we've got is speculation and that would depend on ones feelings on AVB.
Concerning AVB; anybody will tell you that you can't buy 8 new players and then expect to embed them in within a season.
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I think it was over when they sacked AVB. Whether you think Sherwood is a good manager or not he, like AVB, would need years to build a team to challenge for top honours.
Really Vopice, do you really think that was the moment our season was over. The sacking of AVB? Come on we were spiraling out of control. Granted AVB started off okay, but I think that was largely due to the quality of the squad and belief they had from Harry. He clearly was unable to keep that going and was found lacking in so many areas.
Spurs should not have needed years to challenge for the top honours, because the side he inherited was already on the cusp of that ability. The fact that we failed to keep progressing is not solely down to AVB but from where we were to where we are now, is a rapid decline of gargantuan proportions. I blame Levy 75% AVB 15% Us fans for not making more of an issue of this 10%
The reason we WERE doing alright under AVB was simple. Gareth Bale. From day 1 this season we have been crap. Papering over the cracks. Best defence in the league they were saying back in October, having a laugh !! Scoring under 1 goal a game, mostly from the pen spot. 5-0, 6-0 was just waiting to happen, and it did. Therefore he had to sack AVB. What else could he do ?? Following that, no choice other than Sherwood to finish the season.
To try and integrate 7 new players of unproven prem standard was a huge risk.
The only way now is to bring in Van Gaal and pick up the pieces. Get a LB CB(maybe) left winger, creative midfielder and Striker, and sell any of the 7 we can.
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I think it was over when they sacked AVB. Whether you think Sherwood is a good manager or not he, like AVB, would need years to build a team to challenge for top honours.
Really Vopice, do you really think that was the moment our season was over. The sacking of AVB? Come on we were spiraling out of control. Granted AVB started off okay, but I think that was largely due to the quality of the squad and belief they had from Harry. He clearly was unable to keep that going and was found lacking in so many areas.
Spurs should not have needed years to challenge for the top honours, because the side he inherited was already on the cusp of that ability. The fact that we failed to keep progressing is not solely down to AVB but from where we were to where we are now, is a rapid decline of gargantuan proportions. I blame Levy 75% AVB 15% Us fans for not making more of an issue of this 10%
The reason we WERE doing alright under AVB was simple. Gareth Bale. From day 1 this season we have been crap. Papering over the cracks. Best defence in the league they were saying back in October, having a laugh !! Scoring under 1 goal a game, mostly from the pen spot. 5-0, 6-0 was just waiting to happen, and it did. Therefore he had to sack AVB. What else could he do ?? Following that, no choice other than Sherwood to finish the season.
To try and integrate 7 new players of unproven prem standard was a huge risk.
The only way now is to bring in Van Gaal and pick up the pieces. Get a LB CB(maybe) left winger, creative midfielder and Striker, and sell any of the 7 we can.
What concerns me is Sherwood's inexperience. The trouble is we don't know what will happen if he stays for next season. We would be gambling. Great if he pulls it off. But if he doesn't?
I can't think of another top 4 club that has gambled on an inexperienced manager. Maybe Levy has an alternative motive for his appointment?
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I dont think even Van Gaal can stop this sinking ship! not unless he has Ronaldo, Messi, Higuuien, and a lot more secretly line up!,! its not a question of steading the ship as lets face it we dont have a good enough squad to start with!, so where is this magic wand of his going to turn this pile of losers around!.
I hate slagging off my beloved Spurs but the decline from 2 years ago is mind blowing! :tickedoff: , I still cant get my head round it!, its like one minit we where dreaming of challenging for the tittle then waking up after a night on the town to find us in the championship!, that is how I see it! :-[ . After watching the young lads play Benfica last night even in our yourth team there does not appear to be hot prospects coming through who we can nurture into world class players!, its a really worrying time now and as many have said already we just want the season to end!, take 5th spot as damaged limitations! but even that now is going to be dog fight!!. If we are to change then lets start with a solid back four!, do away with this holding of the line at the half way as we are so vunrable on the counter its shocking!, as for the midfield on paper it looks quite decent but paper lies!, Lennon has lost a yard of space time to ship him out!, Pauhlino is Brazillian but Im yet to be convinced he is the creme of the crop!, Dembelle ok and has some drive I can live with him!, Capouue very basic im shore we can do better, get shot of him!, Siggurssen was ok last season but has been lacking this year, a goal threat but not really a winger!, if we are to keep him play him central!, Erriksen is the one shining light of the new boyes!, he could be the next Modric with the right manager and team around him! he stays. Townsend is coming of age and our best natural winger we have so he is a keep but need to be told to stay out wide!, he is no Bale, Adebayor has come in and worked his socks off, chipped in with the goals so his is stone wall keeper!, Soldado has been very dissappointing!, his record else where is brilliant but over here his head does not seem with it! he in my opinion needs to shape up or bugger off! there is no place in football for his complaicency! if he is trying he has to do much much more! simply not good enough!, Harry Kane! scores goals in the reserves but has never been given a long run in the team! this I think needs to change, if he can make the step up then great we have found a gem! but personaly I dont think he will, I cant fault his work rate from what Ive seen of him! he is at least a tryer! so we give him the benefit of the doubt :up: , As for Lloris well he is amazing at shot stopping pulling of some super save but his ball kicking is horendous!, and he is very Bruce grobbalar gun ho which needs addressing quickly!, he comes out way way to far from his goal line and ofton makes mistakes!, his catching can be dodgy as well so he needs toning down!, whats left after all of them well quite frankly not alot and this is where we lack behind the other teams! yes we have a big squad! but not a great one! where is the Lampard to come of the bench!, where is the Defoe!, nothing there is nothing to frighten even a 5 year old so how do we expect to change tight or losing games into wins?.. I could go on and on but I wont! all I ask is for someone to get the team back to the basic rules of football, no flying in tackles! no wondering!, no blaming others, just play football the way its supposed to be played!, think like a team, act like a team, and play like a team!.
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Another key point is how the current top 4 are really pulling away from the rest by way of quality, scoring goals and picking up points.
In recent years 70 points would secure 4th, last season we had a record points haul of 72 and finished 5th behind the goons in 4th on 73.
I think this season the points will again be higher for 4th place, currently the goons sit in 4th on 62 points with 8 games left so a real chance the tally will be higher than 73 for 4th!
If you look at performances of the current top 4 clubs this season they have almost been in a league of their own with some cracking performances and massive score lines (a few against us).
We are now seen I feel as making up the best of the rest, fighting it out for Europa slots and I would expect this for the next few seasons as we go through a transitional stage once more, unless a miracle happens. Man U are in the same boat but unlike us they still have their team that only last season won the league, they just have the management transition period so next season they could be challenging for top 4 who knows!
Dam I mean they signed Mata in their current non challenging campaign so that must tell all something.
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Well its about time they showed some balls :o far to many times we have keeled over! this was a great result in the end and hopefully will have installed some belief into themselves! :) . I am still not happy with the amount of errors we a giving away in our defence!, it seems a certainty now that one of the back 4 is going to have a bad day in every game!, we cant keep this up, it really is not good enough, Im sick to death of the manager coming out and saying " he we learn from it!!!! >:( , they should already know!, all of them have played long enough to know the basics of football, we shoot ourselves in the foot every week and its not good enough!!!! :( .. I think if anything this is where the manager needs to change things in the summer!, or do away with this stupid high line!, it is foolish and pointless!, this only works if you have a midfield closing down the opposition every second, so they dont have time to play a ball over the top or through the gaps!, Spurs dont play that way so we are wide open and when other teams, the better quality players of like Liverpool next week, we will get sevealy punnished!. Our back four are not on the same wave length!, to many times Naughton, Rose Kaboul, Vertonghan burst forward and while another defender has the ball in our half, they try to do a maradonna, with fancy flicks or turns get caught in possession, lose the ball and we are left defenceless as our cover are up the other end of the pitch!, Rose and Naughton are having to act as wingers as Lennon, Townsend, go inside so when they lose the ball high up the pitch a simple ball over the top out to the flanks sends our opponents clean through and so our center backs have to come across leaving the middle open and we get caught out time and time again!. I am not a manager but it is as clear as day what is happening and it cant go on!, our defence is useless!, we got away with it today but that was against Southampton! , we are not going to be so lucky against the top 4!.
Erikksen was amazing today, he is showing the quality we know he has, the more he plays the better, Siggursson was good playing in his preferred role of central, he is much more effective there!, Still dont think Bentaleb is goo enough! we need another Erriksen in there!, we also need to find a way to support the wingers when going forward, when we do get wide the players look isolated, theres no runners bombing passed them for the one twos.
I have quoted Blackjack from another thread because he raised some points that were on my mind during the game yesterday. Living in China has meant I haven’t seen as many full matches as I would like, so much better than watching highlights to get a full picture of where the team is at at the moment. (better still live of course) So after the first 30 minutes I was actually laughing (nervously I think) the way we were playing was school boy level. As blackjack pointed out the tactic from the Saints was simple. Get possession, and then play a diagonal ball to the flanks where there was about a acre of space. Players run on to the ball, beating the non-existent offside trap with ease and then put the ball in the back of the net. Our players were all over the place, out of position and lacking cohesion.
Naughton has never impressed me and I don’t think he even has the quality to be a squad player at the level we require. He must be shipped out. Rose just runs quickly but doesn’t have the skill on the ball. He gets turned and loses track of where the ball and the other players around him are. Good enough for cover, but not a first team player for me. I would rather play kaboul and vertonghen out on the flanks and then put Dawson and Chiriches (once he came back) in the centre until the end of the season. They would surely give us a more solid defense than what we currently have. Except that would leave us exposed to more injury concerns, as we don’t have the CB cover we need, so probably not the solution.
If we are going to play players like Naughton and Rose and our wingers are going to come inside most of the time, then we should be playing them as wingbacks and play 5 across the back. Then when they dart forward (and lose the ball) the 3 CB can cover either flank leaving 2 in the middle. I know this system isn't played very much anymore, but looking at the players we have and the lack of our preferred and traditional 442 it seems the logical thing to do. It may be worth trying out at least.
The other thing that concerns me is our lack of awareness of who is where on the pitch. Not to get into the Harry debate again, but a couple of years ago our passing was fast; the players moved the ball around, from front to back, left to right. Everyone knew where to put the ball and where to move to after they played it. Yesterday, it was none of those things. Even after we improved and got back into the game, I never felt we were a real threat. When the ball did move out wide, the ball was crossed to an area where there weren’t any players there. They didn’t look up, they were not playing a cross, they were just hitting an area and hoping someone would be there. Granted, sometimes it went to the very place a player should be attacking, but it all seemed hit and hope for me. The look on Soldado’s face when the cross whizzed past him, said it all. He may not have had a great season, but with service like that, what chance does he have. Give him the ball in the right places and we would see a completely different player next season.
However, I think Sherwood made some positive changes and that was credit to him. But I agree we need to change our defensive mindset next year. If Sherwood is the man in charge next year, then I think he really needs to set out his game plan from the start. Get the players which can play the style he believes in and maybe we could improve. But I am very worried that Levy will find some way to screw it up again, even if it starts getting better. Levy has made too many mistakes and never once apologized for them even that would go some way to repair the relationship with the fans. But for him, it is always somebody else’s fault.
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I dont think even Van Gaal can stop this sinking ship! not unless he has Ronaldo, Messi, Higuuien, and a lot more secretly line up!,! its not a question of steading the ship as lets face it we dont have a good enough squad to start with!, so where is this magic wand of his going to turn this pile of losers around!.
I hate slagging off my beloved Spurs but the decline from 2 years ago is mind blowing! :tickedoff: , I still cant get my head round it!, its like one minit we where dreaming of challenging for the tittle then waking up after a night on the town to find us in the championship!, that is how I see it! :-[ . After watching the young lads play Benfica last night even in our yourth team there does not appear to be hot prospects coming through who we can nurture into world class players!, its a really worrying time now and as many have said already we just want the season to end!, take 5th spot as damaged limitations! but even that now is going to be dog fight!!. If we are to change then lets start with a solid back four!, do away with this holding of the line at the half way as we are so vunrable on the counter its shocking!, as for the midfield on paper it looks quite decent but paper lies!, Lennon has lost a yard of space time to ship him out!, Pauhlino is Brazillian but Im yet to be convinced he is the creme of the crop!, Dembelle ok and has some drive I can live with him!, Capouue very basic im shore we can do better, get shot of him!, Siggurssen was ok last season but has been lacking this year, a goal threat but not really a winger!, if we are to keep him play him central!, Erriksen is the one shining light of the new boyes!, he could be the next Modric with the right manager and team around him! he stays. Townsend is coming of age and our best natural winger we have so he is a keep but need to be told to stay out wide!, he is no Bale, Adebayor has come in and worked his socks off, chipped in with the goals so his is stone wall keeper!, Soldado has been very dissappointing!, his record else where is brilliant but over here his head does not seem with it! he in my opinion needs to shape up or bugger off! there is no place in football for his complaicency! if he is trying he has to do much much more! simply not good enough!, Harry Kane! scores goals in the reserves but has never been given a long run in the team! this I think needs to change, if he can make the step up then great we have found a gem! but personaly I dont think he will, I cant fault his work rate from what Ive seen of him! he is at least a tryer! so we give him the benefit of the doubt :up: , As for Lloris well he is amazing at shot stopping pulling of some super save but his ball kicking is horendous!, and he is very Bruce grobbalar gun ho which needs addressing quickly!, he comes out way way to far from his goal line and ofton makes mistakes!, his catching can be dodgy as well so he needs toning down!, whats left after all of them well quite frankly not alot and this is where we lack behind the other teams! yes we have a big squad! but not a great one! where is the Lampard to come of the bench!, where is the Defoe!, nothing there is nothing to frighten even a 5 year old so how do we expect to change tight or losing games into wins?.. I could go on and on but I wont! all I ask is for someone to get the team back to the basic rules of football, no flying in tackles! no wondering!, no blaming others, just play football the way its supposed to be played!, think like a team, act like a team, and play like a team!.
I have just read this post again, and I think it sums up our problems perfectly. Whoever is our manager next season, the things that blackjack highlights need addressing during the transfer window.
1. Our back 4 are nowhere near good enough. Especially we need urgently a RB & LB. For me, Zeki Fryers is the only one who shows enough potential to persevere with. At CB, Cherices ( if he gets fit, and stays) I think is the best we have, along with Verthonghen ( also if he stays) and Kaboul. It is imperative that we operate with a consistent and proper defensive unit, one that the likes of Walker, Dawson & Rose can slot into if our 1st choice 4 get injured ( Sorry I do not rate Walker, Dawson & Rose as good enough regulars if we ever want to get top 4)
Sandro / Dembele seem to be going backwards of late, who knows why. Lennon would appear to be past his sell by date, so a new out and out right winger is needed, to balance up with Townsend, who I think we should persevere with. Eriksen is making the no 10 spot his own, Chadli, Siggurdson, lamela ( if ever fit) I think the jury are still out on. Either way we need to be looking at a "Frank Lampard - Steven Gerrard" style midfielder, I think.
As for upfront, well I really think we should be looking at 2 strikers. Soldado, despite some useful assists, just cannot find his scoring boots. Adebayor is never ever going to re-capture his previous goalscoring form. Defoe is gone, and Kane, well he dosen't look like he has it either.
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Horray Horray we beat Southampton and scored 3 goals at home!, even won a game after playing in Europe the same week! :D great we have turned the tide, thats it lets kick on on and blow all the remaining teams away and finish 5th :) :) :) ... Then I wake up :2funny: .. O well I can dream cant I?.
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Horray Horray we beat Southampton and scored 3 goals at home!, even won a game after playing in Europe the same week! :D great we have turned the tide, thats it lets kick on on and blow all the remaining teams away and finish 5th :) :) :) ... Then I wake up :2funny: .. O well I can dream cant I?.
I think we will find out where we are after the Liverpool game :D
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Nothing will change for the better until levy is ousted .Everything thats gone wrong can be traced back to him .
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Nothing will change for the better until levy is ousted .Everything thats gone wrong can be traced back to him .
be careful what you ask for; you might get something a lot worse. At the moment there is nobody knocking on the Spurs door.
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Even leaving aside the Liverpool game, we still have 18 points to fight for which gives us a max of 74 to aim for. That should tell us all we need to know about our squad, thats if we dont already know it.
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Nothing will change for the better until levy is ousted .Everything thats gone wrong can be traced back to him .
be careful what you ask for; you might get something a lot worse. At the moment there is nobody knocking on the Spurs door.
I think Levy needs to go, at least should take a step back from the decision making process. No one is asking for new owners, Joe Lewis can still be the main owner.
It is too easy to say, 'be careful what you wish for' - in a way that invokes fear, like wishing for better is wrong and ooooh isn't life scary when you take a chance. Well guess what? most of the people who own football clubs are all the kind of people who take risk.
Nobody succeeds always doing what you have always done because If doing so hasn't brought success already...it never will!
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Stability and consistency breed sucess and we have no chance of either with him in charge .He`ll sack sherwood in the summer unless an absolute miracle occurs and he`ll appoint anew manager .In two seasons or so he`ll sack him if we`re no better off and it will all start again .
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Nothing will change for the better until levy is ousted .Everything thats gone wrong can be traced back to him .
be careful what you ask for; you might get something a lot worse. At the moment there is nobody knocking on the Spurs door.
I think Levy needs to go, at least should take a step back from the decision making process. No one is asking for new owners, Joe Lewis can still be the main owner.
It is too easy to say, 'be careful what you wish for' - in a way that invokes fear, like wishing for better is wrong and ooooh isn't life scary when you take a chance. Well guess what? most of the people who own football clubs are all the kind of people who take risk.
Nobody succeeds always doing what you have always done because If doing so hasn't brought success already...it never will!
What I meant by that remark was you could get somebody a lot worse. Somebody like the Cardiff owner. I would rather have Levy than some owners out there.
Also; nobody is knocking on Spurs doors to take over. In that case we need Levy. I would rather have him than allowing the club to go rudderless.
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Stability and consistency breed sucess and we have no chance of either with him in charge .He`ll sack sherwood in the summer unless an absolute miracle occurs and he`ll appoint anew manager .In two seasons or so he`ll sack him if we`re no better off and it will all start again .
Both Wenger, and especially Fergie, had difficult starts to their prem careers, so this is a good point.
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Stability and consistency breed sucess and we have no chance of either with him in charge .He`ll sack sherwood in the summer unless an absolute miracle occurs and he`ll appoint anew manager .In two seasons or so he`ll sack him if we`re no better off and it will all start again .
Both Wenger, and especially Fergie, had difficult starts to their prem careers, so this is a good point.
Levy should look after the business aspects of the club only and leave the footballing decisions including who is to be head coach/manager to someone who knows about the game!
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Sherwood is a new, younger manager learning the ropes!, he has done a great job with the yourth team and has now made the step up so lets get behind him!, lets not judge to much this season as it has been make do with this lot and do your best!, miracles welcome ::) . Next season will be the time to judge him once he has got the team he wants,( if allowed or still there!), as mentioned before Sir Alex fergusson was nearly relegated in his first managerial season and look what happened to him :up: , all managers have to start somewhere and all of our other managers have been through bad spells some of which never recovered!, just look when Santini took over, I remember watching a preseason friendly and we had some new signings, one was a striker called Silva, flippin eck he couldnt even kick a ball let alone play football!!!, I was appaulled ??? where in the hell we found him I dont know!, he never even made it into the first team!, there where others aswell but cant remember now, anyway this highlighted our problems early on!, we clearly had either a usless scout or director of football, we had a manager in charge who clearly never wanted the job in the first place but got pushed into saying yes which proved to be a complete desaster :-[ . In comes Martin Jol who did a fantastic job slowly but surely we edged up the league into European places but we still could not beat the top 4 sides and we still slipped up at cup sides!, next come Ramos the next best thing since slice bread who tried his milatary tactics!, dont eat this dont eat that, bla bla bla, which too upset the players but also seem to have no effect on our team!, then comes Harry who was a master stroke by Levy who I thank( about the only thing I will do for). Harry b rought back the old fashioned way of playing, pass and move, move the ball quickly, attack with pace etc, he brought in some great signings and the team flourished, we even started taking points of the top 4, soon we ourselves had broken into that barrier and where now starting to push on!, everybody happy!. Then came England knocking, court cases and all and a end of season slump! but we still fineshed fourth again but alas the champions league was not ment to be!, Levy then plays the not good enough card and out goes Harry in come AVB Mourinhos apprentice a little experience and success with Porto so all looks good!, the trouble with this was he tried to implement his portugese style of football into the club!, he started dismantling a pretty good team to make his own side, what he failed to do and realise is Spurs where not used to playing that style, they never had the same quality players in the correct positions and not all english footballers are great teckniquly!!, they are not all Messi, Fabregas, Silva, Van Persie, etc, that are used to playing tight one touch passing through many players!, they are all comfortable with the ball while being heavly pressed!. AVB phylosophy was to work from the back which is ok and flood the midfield, push the defence right up to the half way line and pin in the opposition in there own half, win the ball then be clear on goal!, he liked to play a lone striker who was brought from playing in a team playing 4-4-2.W.T.F!!, all this put together back fired!, we where not scoring goals as the striker had no service, the midfield suffercated as there was no space to move without running into there own players!, the defence was non existant as they where all practicly playing midfielder being so high up the pitch leaving a goalkeeper being asked to be superman and hold the fort on his own.
I ask you this how can anyone expect Tim Sherwood to get things perfect straight away?, absolute no chance, no manager in the world could do it with this current mess so lets be patient and give Tim time to have a real crack of the whip.
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Giving Sherwood a chance sounds fair enough provided that he does finish the season well and a few people here doubt that he will.
So I will agree that, should this season end reasonably well ie: 5th under the present trend would be the best we could expect. He would have my vote to carry on as our manager next season. Anything lower would be a failure in my book. Besides, I cannot see Levy point in giving him the job if we end up 6th or lower.
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Giving Sherwood a chance sounds fair enough provided that he does finish the season well and a few people here doubt that he will.
So I will agree that, should this season end reasonably well ie: 5th under the present trend would be the best we could expect. He would have my vote to carry on as our manager next season. Anything lower would be a failure in my book. Besides, I cannot see Levy point in giving him the job if we end up 6th or lower.
If anyone thinks we are going to finish any higher than 6th I am afraid they are dreaming (and to blame TS for that would be a travesty of justice), so obviously Joolz in your opinion Sherwood should be sacked, no-one can blame TS for this seasons debacle, the blame must lay fairly and squarely on Levy and AVB's shoulders. We need stability within the coaching ranks, otherwise this trend we will continue. Give TS a minimum of Two, yes 2 years, to get the team that HE wants and to get them playing the way that HE wants them to play, he is Spurs through and through and he is English, I do not subscribe to the theory that to be successful we have to have a continental coach, very nearly every foreign coach that we have had in recent times, has been a disaster! >:( >:(
Just my opinion. :nods: :nods:
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Giving Sherwood a chance sounds fair enough provided that he does finish the season well and a few people here doubt that he will.
So I will agree that, should this season end reasonably well ie: 5th under the present trend would be the best we could expect. He would have my vote to carry on as our manager next season. Anything lower would be a failure in my book. Besides, I cannot see Levy point in giving him the job if we end up 6th or lower.
If anyone thinks we are going to finish any higher than 6th I am afraid they are dreaming (and to blame TS for that would be a travesty of justice), so obviously Joolz in your opinion Sherwood should be sacked, no-one can blame TS for this seasons debacle, the blame must lay fairly and squarely on Levy and AVB's shoulders. We need stability within the coaching ranks, otherwise this trend we will continue. Give TS a minimum of Two, yes 2 years, to get the team that HE wants and to get them playing the way that HE wants them to play, he is Spurs through and through and he is English, I do not subscribe to the theory that to be successful we have to have a continental coach, very nearly every foreign coach that we have had in recent times, has been a disaster! >:( >:(
Just my opinion. :nods: :nods:
Agreed, I think 6th is probably the highest we can realistically expect to hold on to. Everton are looking stronger and stronger and the only reason we aren't lower in the league is because beyond everyone's expectations Man U are performing worse than we all hoped for.
The saddest thing is that this was the year to make a sustained and meaningful attack on the top four. With Fergie leaving, they were going to take time to transition. Liverpool did what we should have been doing and look at them now!
I am happy to give Sherwood another season at least to see what he can do. But I really wish that our club were more honest and up front about their intentions and decisions. I think that to give him that fair chance he should be allowed to spend 35 million on any one player and any other changes need to be made by selling first. If that means he has to sell 3 players to buy another good one and then get the rest through loan deals or buying the younger or older players then so be it.
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The last post is spot on, let Tim get the team he wants then judge him, he has the passion we need, and if he can get that same stuff into his players we will be ok, let's not moan and blame Tim, and yes we will be lucky to get 5th, realisticly 6th but let's not forget MU are not to far behind so even 7th may have to do if we slip up too many more times, you may not want to here this but its fact!,. Should we get a new manager for the new season we may find ourselves in the exact same situation this time next season!, I keep saying it but thete is no quick fix here!, we have no leader, we have no Lampard,Gerrard in our team to galvernise the team, we have no defence unit that understands how to work together, we have no balance on the flanks going forward, the midfield and strikers don't work well enough together, the midield don't know how to anticipate the runs of the strikers!, the strikers are starved of service and support so all rhis taken into consideration there is no way all this can be fixed quickly, we always here new managers spend weeks accessing there new team but this only makes the start of the new season a waist , the changes must be put in place well before the new season starts.
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The last post is spot on, let Tim get the team he wants then judge him, he has the passion we need, and if he can get that same stuff into his players we will be ok, let's not moan and blame Tim, and yes we will be lucky to get 5th, realisticly 6th but let's not forget MU are not to far behind so even 7th may have to do if we slip up too many more times, you may not want to here this but its fact!,. Should we get a new manager for the new season we may find ourselves in the exact same situation this time next season!, I keep saying it but thete is no quick fix here!, we have no leader, we have no Lampard,Gerrard in our team to galvernise the team, we have no defence unit that understands how to work together, we have no balance on the flanks going forward, the midfield and strikers don't work well enough together, the midield don't know how to anticipate the runs of the strikers!, the strikers are starved of service and support so all rhis taken into consideration there is no way all this can be fixed quickly, we always here new managers spend weeks accessing there new team but this only makes the start of the new season a waist , the changes must be put in place well before the new season starts.
Agreed
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I liked sherwood as a player and having met him briefly i liked him as a person but i`m afraid as a manager he`s just not experienced enough . We need an experienced , astute manager who can handle levy as well as the pressure that the EPL brings .Sherwood may have the confidence and self belief but i`m afriad he had been out thought far too often tactically for my liking .The likes of wenger , mourhinio and probably rodgers on sunday turn him inside out on tactics .He isn`t to blame for whats happened this season as he was dropped in the s**t by levy when he pressed the panic button and sacked AVB .As ive said already , changing the manager isn`t the answer .Ridding our beloved club of the interfering , dictatorial menace that is daniel levy IS the answer :tickedoff:
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Its great to see so many backing TS and giving him the vote of confidence, but does anyone really expect him to be here next season I just cant see it, in all honesty I think another manager is already a done deal for after the world cup.
Whilst there are many aspects about TS I am not keen on what I do like is his passion for our club and open honesty (although not always best delivered to the media), if only that could be combined with some more experience and tactical genius/awareness I would punt for him to get a contract for a couple of years.
The end to our season will be very interesting as to how we finish are things coming together etc, is their hope for next season if we dont buy etc.
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I liked sherwood as a player and having met him briefly i liked him as a person but i`m afraid as a manager he`s just not experienced enough . We need an experienced , astute manager who can handle levy as well as the pressure that the EPL brings .Sherwood may have the confidence and self belief but i`m afriad he had been out thought far too often tactically for my liking .The likes of wenger , mourhinio and probably rodgers on sunday turn him inside out on tactics .He isn`t to blame for whats happened this season as he was dropped in the s**t by levy when he pressed the panic button and sacked AVB .As ive said already , changing the manager isn`t the answer .Ridding our beloved club of the interfering , dictatorial menace that is daniel levy IS the answer :tickedoff:
I dont think theres a manager on this planet that can influence Levys dicision making!, its his way or the high way and out the door you go!. this is why its going to be extremly difficult ever finding a suiter to truely get the best out of a Spurs team.
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I liked sherwood as a player and having met him briefly i liked him as a person but i`m afraid as a manager he`s just not experienced enough . We need an experienced , astute manager who can handle levy as well as the pressure that the EPL brings .Sherwood may have the confidence and self belief but i`m afriad he had been out thought far too often tactically for my liking .The likes of wenger , mourhinio and probably rodgers on sunday turn him inside out on tactics .He isn`t to blame for whats happened this season as he was dropped in the s**t by levy when he pressed the panic button and sacked AVB .As ive said already , changing the manager isn`t the answer .Ridding our beloved club of the interfering , dictatorial menace that is daniel levy IS the answer :tickedoff:
I dont think theres a manager on this planet that can influence Levys dicision making!, its his way or the high way and out the door you go!. this is why its going to be extremly difficult ever finding a suiter to truely get the best out of a Spurs team.
I think you're right there. Even Harry, with all his experience, only ever got the players he wanted when it suited Levy. I still remember, when we were pushing for 4th again, Harry in the January window wanted a striker and CB. What did he get ? Saha and Nelson. Can anyone imagine Mourinho, Wenger or Rogers putting up with that ? If Tim can engineer 18 points from the last 7 games ( 6 wins excluding Liverpool) then we would have 74 points, another prem record for us, and his case to continue would be overwhelming. And is there any reason why we shouldn't win the last 6 ?? Sunderland WBA Fulham Stoke West Ham Aston Villa.
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To be honest guys I think we are going to see another record 4th place total this year!, so even if we do win 6/7 games and got 74 points I believe this might not still be enough!. :'(
It just goed to show you how high the quality of the players now are in the premiership!, nothing less than world class will cut it anymore!, if over the next few seasons this continues then it will be near impossible to break into a top 4 finish as a very low overall loss count will be required and to guarantee that a team will need a chairmen with very very big pockets indeed!.
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Martinez and Everton look the real deal this season. Not spent loads of money, but make good decisions. Maybe we should have trusted what Dave Whelan was saying about him, rather than go for the Portuguese non-wonder kid! Just saying.
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Shocking, shambles, rubbish call it as it is, Spurs are mediodre now at best and most definatley going backwards!, get rid of the entire back four as they just can not work together!, I think things are only going to get worse! no where near good enough as the teams above us!, I now think this is one of the worst Spurs sides I can remember...clueless and taking the piss out of the manager and fans!!!.
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Shocking, shambles, rubbish call it as it is, Spurs are mediodre now at best and most definatley going backwards!, get rid of the entire back four as they just can not work together!, I think things are only going to get worse! no where near good enough as the teams above us!, I now think this is one of the worst Spurs sides I can remember...clueless and taking the piss out of the manager and fans!!!.
I think that it is becoming clearer and clearer, week by week that the overriding problem at our club is Levy.
When is he ever going to make the right decision for the club ? As far as I can see the one and only right thing he has ever done was appointing Harry. And he undid that one !!
Judging by Sherwoods demeanor, and comments of late, he is next for the chop. And then what ? Bring in a new manager, to do what ?? We make schoolboy errors every single game, no matter who the opposition are. How can that be cured ?? Answer, get rid of the vast majority of the team and start again. Write off another 2 or 3 years.
Quite frankly, the only players we have who are good enough, or can even be bothered are Lloris Eriksen and Chadli. What a mess !!!
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When Harry took over the club was in a mess and we looked like we were going nowhere. He sorted out the mess we were in pretty quickly, recognizing the areas that needed improving, and got the best from what was already there. He did this in less than a season and the following year we were up at the right end of the table and looked like we were going places.
However to do this he bought Palacios and Cudincini and brought back Defoe, Keane and Chimbonda. For about 30 million. In the summer he added Crouch, Krancjar and Bassong for about 20 million. That is 8 players in less than a year, for just under 50 Million.
With this information in mind I am left wondering the following things:
- How come Harry could buy in 8 new players and create a team that ended up in 4th? Yet we are saying that AVB/Baldini/Levy were wrong to buy 7 new players and expect them to play well. Whose to really blame for this oversight?
- If we got the right man are we being too negative to think that we couldn't be back and challenging by this time next year?
- None of these players were world class players (even though we craved one or two) but they were still able to challenge the top 4. So why can't these players who cost considerably more and were rated more highly at the time of purchase?
- I think there are too many people who failed to appreciate what an amazing job Harry did. (Particularly Levy)
- If this was the squad Harry took over in 2008, what would be the first thing he would do?
- I am beginning to think that that TS may also have to go, but only if Levy goes as well. I think we need a completely clean slate, starting right from the top and filtering down. (sorry Tim, not your fault, but the hammerings have not helped your cause)
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The majority of the players you mentioned had Premier League experience. Some had even played for Spurs before. None of the 7 we brought in this year had that and most have failed to adapt. They may improve but even if they don't we may well be stuck with them. Who is going to pay us £27 Million for Soldado ? We'd be lucky to get £10 mill at the moment and Levy is not going to take that.
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When Harry took over the club was in a mess and we looked like we were going nowhere. He sorted out the mess we were in pretty quickly, recognizing the areas that needed improving, and got the best from what was already there. He did this in less than a season and the following year we were up at the right end of the table and looked like we were going places.
However to do this he bought Palacios and Cudincini and brought back Defoe, Keane and Chimbonda. For about 30 million. In the summer he added Crouch, Krancjar and Bassong for about 20 million. That is 8 players in less than a year, for just under 50 Million.
With this information in mind I am left wondering the following things:
- How come Harry could buy in 8 new players and create a team that ended up in 4th? Yet we are saying that AVB/Baldini/Levy were wrong to buy 7 new players and expect them to play well. Whose to really blame for this oversight?
- If we got the right man are we being too negative to think that we couldn't be back and challenging by this time next year?
- None of these players were world class players (even though we craved one or two) but they were still able to challenge the top 4. So why can't these players who cost considerably more and were rated more highly at the time of purchase?
- I think there are too many people who failed to appreciate what an amazing job Harry did. (Particularly Levy)
- If this was the squad Harry took over in 2008, what would be the first thing he would do?
- I am beginning to think that that TS may also have to go, but only if Levy goes as well. I think we need a completely clean slate, starting right from the top and filtering down. (sorry Tim, not your fault, but the hammerings have not helped your cause)
Most of what you say I fully agree with you, and for all thosee of you out there that think Harry was not good enough then wake up!, where would you rather be right now?, 4/5th with great players and giving the big teams a good run for there money? Or where we are now?,, there is only one answer...back with Harry!, He carefully built his team up gradually merging new players with old and getting a good team spirit and ethics, key areas where addressed with some great tranfers and all fell into place, the team responded marvelously and we even had some good young talent coming through the acadamy!, now we have sold our prospects, our experinced players and with no young talent in the wind and no flare player(game changer) to look to when we most need it!, this sums up our club right now, lost, no real advance but a massive decrease, what needs to be done is get rid of he scout and director of football and bring in the best at spotting young talent!, we need to get players who are technicly good in every position, so the team is comfortable with the ball, players that know to look before they pass, and pass and move, if they are all spanish,brazillian, Italian, whatever as long as the team plays the ball on the deck comfortably!,and not rely on going back to the goalkeeper every few mins as there to find frightened to go forward. I would like Tim to carry on next season so I can see who he brings in, in the summer.
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The majority of the players you mentioned had Premier League experience. Some had even played for Spurs before. None of the 7 we brought in this year had that and most have failed to adapt. They may improve but even if they don't we may well be stuck with them. Who is going to pay us £27 Million for Soldado ? We'd be lucky to get £10 mill at the moment and Levy is not going to take that.
I agree, but therein lies the problem!!! Bad decisions built on more bad decisions. What I find hardest to swallow is that nothing was done, before it was too late.
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I think that there is one unfortunate thing that will stop our club from ever being right up there and challenging for top honours and that is the Chairman ... Daniel Levy. To be fair he is a fantastic business man and brilliant negotiator that has managed to get the very best for the club in transfer dealings and business deals over the last 10 years or so.... but as soon as someone comes along to challenge his ego they have to go because DAniel has to be top dog !!!
Harry Redknapp as I think we all have realised now had plenty more to give Spurs and with a little backing by Levy would I'm sure have taken us on to challenge for the title especially this season during all the early season turmoil. Unfortunately Harry wouldn't back down to Levy over the England job and I for one say fair play to Harry, it wasn't like he was going to a rival team or selling players on the cheap to our rivals ... he was asking to be allowed to be considered for the top job in English football in a funny sort of way that was a back handed complement to Spurs.
When Harry never got the England job he went to Levy and said Ok you offered me a contract lets talk, but no lets cut of our nose to spite our face and sack Redknapp for even considering the England position that the Media so wanted him to have. At the time Redknapp was at the top of his stock and would of been able to attract players and probably persuaded players to stay but no Levy decides to bring in someone he knows he can 'bully' in AVB and this senario will continue until Levy is replaced.
The unfortunate situation we all must live with is the fact the Daniel Levy is never going to let anyone become bigger than him at Spurs and that will always hold us back regardless !!!
This summer Sherwood will go and the next poor sucker will take up the reigns until Levy feels threatened and takes away the transfer funds and support of the board.... it's happened for the last 10 or so years so there's no reason to think it will alter anytime soon !!!
:'( :'( :'(
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" To be fair he is a fantastic business man and brilliant negotiator that has managed to get the very best for the club in transfer dealings and business deals over the last 10 years or so"
Are you having a laugh! ::) ,his decisions mostly have got us in this mess!, the 110m from Bale has not been spent well at all!, we did not bring in anywhere near good enough quality players back to this club!, we sold a world beater with lightning pace and dribble ability and replaced him with none!, yes we bought Chadli but he does not have the pace!, we need some real sprinters in our team!, another Ginola!, someone to frighten the life out of players!, we need better technicaly ball controll players like Fabregas/Silva, and most of all we need world class defenders that dont panic!, a leader at the back like a Terry,Kompany,Vidic.
His decision sacked the best manager we had in years!, he did not like us having older exsperienced players like Parker, He sold Modric, Vandervart, Carrick,Bale,Defoe, Keane,etc and everytime one good player went we kept buying young players that where supposed to be superstars in a few years yet we never here anything more of them?, whats happened to the young lad from Barcelona we bought a few years ago, was supposed to be the next marradona!, we sold Caulker a very good English up and coming center back who is having a blinder for Hull chipping in with goals aswell!, Tom Carol loaned out to QPR, a young gerrad/Lampard coming through but we ship him out when we most need cool and calm heads!, all this is down to Levy wanting his team by a manager robot he can control!, he is just waiting to say I did this I did that and take all the credit!, but what the fool fails to realise is onl the manager reads a football team correctly, only a manager can judge what needs to be done, only a manager can choose who and where he wants his players, so untill we are given a manager who is alowed to buy his players no excuses will we ever have a real chance of becoming a force again and that my friends is a million miles away right now.
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I hate to start with a moan but really that's why I came on here!! Agree with you Blackjack. IMO the real problem with our management is that they won't spend money. I am sick of hearing pundits bang on about how much Spurs have spent this season. If you do the maths, after the sale of Bale and a good few others, we actually took in MORE money than we spent. So where's the big expense. My point is you can't compete in the Premier without spending big. I don't like that fact but it is, nonetheless, a FACT. We have a billionaire owner who won't put his hand in his pocket. We don't need to buy 7 or 8 players we need to buy 2 or 3 top players. As Blackjack says, we need the likes of Kompany or fabregas or hazard and above all a goalscorer!! I am tired of watching the team I have loved for over forty years playing dull, slow and ultimately pointless football. I grew up watching ardiles, hoddle, Archibald and then lineaker ginola et al. We may not have won much but we were a joy to watch. Lewis, spend some money or clear off!!
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I hate to start with a moan but really that's why I came on here!! Agree with you Blackjack. IMO the real problem with our management is that they won't spend money. I am sick of hearing pundits bang on about how much Spurs have spent this season. If you do the maths, after the sale of Bale and a good few others, we actually took in MORE money than we spent. So where's the big expense. My point is you can't compete in the Premier without spending big. I don't like that fact but it is, nonetheless, a FACT. We have a billionaire owner who won't put his hand in his pocket. We don't need to buy 7 or 8 players we need to buy 2 or 3 top players. As Blackjack says, we need the likes of Kompany or fabregas or hazard and above all a goalscorer!! I am tired of watching the team I have loved for over forty years playing dull, slow and ultimately pointless football. I grew up watching ardiles, hoddle, Archibald and then lineaker ginola et al. We may not have won much but we were a joy to watch. Lewis, spend some money or clear off!!
Firstly, welcome to the forum Badger, its refreshing to have someone new here. And your comments are perfectly correct. I would add to that, if we are paying our supposed best players 40 - 60 K a week, is it any wonder we cannot get players in who end up on 160 K or more elsewhere ?
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It really comes down to, to be big you have to spend big with the exception of Everton who have slowly bringing there youth team through and added a little here and there, here lies: why they have suddenly launched a charge on the premier league!, they have always been in and around us, but with them they did not demand top4 or put pressure on there managers!, they built a squad gradually and never sold there best players when big guns came knocking!, they brought in some quality on loan with Lakaku, and have, Baines and young Barkly coming of age to name but a few, they have Disten and Jagielka experienced center backs to organise the troops. This is where we where under Harry but not now, we ripped apart a very good unit and sold our key players!, ripped the heart out of a once very good team and for what? A chairmens bloody ego! :-[
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Whether fans think Sherwood is a good thing or not I think he will be gone by the summer. With us also struggling for a Europa placing for next season that might not be a bad thing. It will give the new manager a chance to regroup and build a team. Just like Rogers did.
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A report from sky sports concerning our new stadium plans which the club hopes to move into in 2017, its also reported we tried to buy Upton Park and may move to Wembley on a temp basis whilst the new stadium is built next to WHL.
Finances put us back in the black also, The club announced that they had made a £1.5m profit for the year ending 30 June 2013. This comes after they made a loss of £4.2m in 2012. Revenue also went up by 2% from £144.2m to £147.4m.
Seems many aspects have gone forwards where as on the pitch we have gone back 10 years!
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Cant believe Levy dared to try to buy Upton Park!, after his spies made the accusations about West Ham doing dodgy buissness over the olympic stadium!, that sums him up perfectly! lol.
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A report from sky sports concerning our new stadium plans which the club hopes to move into in 2017, its also reported we tried to buy Upton Park and may move to Wembley on a temp basis whilst the new stadium is built next to WHL.
Finances put us back in the black also, The club announced that they had made a £1.5m profit for the year ending 30 June 2013. This comes after they made a loss of £4.2m in 2012. Revenue also went up by 2% from £144.2m to £147.4m.
Seems many aspects have gone forwards where as on the pitch we have gone back 10 years!
Yes Metal, mostly due to bad managers and even worse transfers
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In toadys papers.."Tottenham fans can expect quality over quantity from their summer transfers according to chairman Daniel Levy, who says they will concentrate on a few signings to 'strengthen key positions'." Lol, yeah right!, thats what they promised this year :up: and look what we got!, Il believe it when I see it!, all we will get is the players nobody else wants as always, does he really think we are going to bite that carrot seriously?.
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In toadys papers.."Tottenham fans can expect quality over quantity from their summer transfers according to chairman Daniel Levy, who says they will concentrate on a few signings to 'strengthen key positions'." Lol, yeah right!, thats what they promised this year :up: and look what we got!, Il believe it when I see it!, all we will get is the players nobody else wants as always, does he really think we are going to bite that carrot seriously?.
Unless he's gonna start paying 150 k + a week, all we will get is, as you rightly say, the players who nobody else wants.
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A report from sky sports concerning our new stadium plans which the club hopes to move into in 2017, its also reported we tried to buy Upton Park and may move to Wembley on a temp basis whilst the new stadium is built next to WHL.
Finances put us back in the black also, The club announced that they had made a £1.5m profit for the year ending 30 June 2013. This comes after they made a loss of £4.2m in 2012. Revenue also went up by 2% from £144.2m to £147.4m.
Seems many aspects have gone forwards where as on the pitch we have gone back 10 years!
I think a lot of those so-called offers (like Upton Park or the Olympic stadium) were made to put pressure on Haringey Council to get more concessions. And to be honest it has worked. The Tottenham area would be devastated if Spurs pulled out.